Portuguese residency - current situation - advice needed

[webcraft]

Sorry to appear thick but don’t quite see where the flexibility from the Schengen 90/180 rule, to spend most of the winter in the Canaries, comes from

If you don’t have residency, how do you propose to spend in excess of 90 days in 180 days in The Canaries

Even if you have Portuguese residency, you would still not be able to spend more than 90 days in 180 in Spain. Yes, you could ‘hide’ in Madeira. Unfortunately, the weather factor in Madeira, in winter is not all that wonderful.

Mind you, rather than Madeira, Agadir could provide you with a useful bolt hole.

Reasonable marina, reasonable town, reasonable weather and outside the EU. It also has a good air service to the UK. Spent a month there once and was well impressed, with Casablanca, Marrakech and other interesting places relatively near by.

What are your thought for the summer months, back to the UK

Whatever, best of luck with the engine and the quest for residency??

Plan is to spend the Summer months sailing back in Scotland on the Vega. If I can liberate her from the boatyard.

Madeira in Winter beats Oban!

Just winging it at the moment, times are too crazy and money and time too short to do anything else.

- W

 

[nortada]

Plan is to spend the Summer months sailing back in Scotland on the Vega. If I can liberate her from the boatyard.

Madeira in Winter beats Oban!

Just winging it at the moment, times are too crazy and money and time too short to do anything else.

- W

Thanks for the update.

Almost exactly the same as us, summer boating on the East Coast and winter sailing in The Algarve but making sure that we spend more than 6 months of the year in Portugal.

N

 

[webcraft]

Thanks for the update.

Almost exactly the same as us, summer boating on the East Coast and winter sailing in The Algarve but making sure that we spend more than 6 months of the year in Portugal.

Is the Algarve sailable all Winter?

Chilly at night already here in Cascais.

- W

 

[nortada]

Is the Algarve sailable all Winter?

Chilly at night already here in Cascais.

- W

Very, as you will find when you round Vincent, weather patterns change completely. Yes, chilly at night but gorgeous settled sunny days most of the time. Predominate northerly wind (The Nortada ), an east/west coastline makes for tons of fast reaches in calm inshore waters.

N

 

[Graham376]

Is the Algarve sailable all Winter?

Chilly at night already here in Cascais.
- W

Plenty of good winter sailing weather in Algarve, we found Lisbon area cooler last week than Faro but still better than N Wales, it's pi***ng down!

 

[GHA]

Is the Algarve sailable all Winter?

Very much so. And fine to live on the hook. Many live up the Ria Guadiana, maybe one or 2 floods a year but usually well forecast and not really much of a problem to find an out of the way spot to sit it out or pop into one of the marinas at the mouth. Many go up there, not all leave again though....

 

[webcraft]

Update...

Portuguese daughter in law's solicitor friend says we need to have been in Portugal for three months to get residency.

- W

 

[nortada]

Hi,

How is the engine problem progressing??

Did you intend to get this far before the New Year

 

[nortada]

Not true in Lagos.

Plenty of cases of people arriving and getting temporary residency with in days.

Think the record I’d held by a Scot who arrived later one evening, got his berthing contact first thing the next day and residency by lunchtime. All within 24 hours rather than 3 months.

If you are in Portugal for 90 days continuously by law you are required to register (not the same as residency). You have 30 days grace to comply or could face a €1,500 fine. Never heard of it being enforced.

You might find this useful:- How To Become A Portuguese Resident & Keep Your British Passport - All You Need To Know About Registering & Residency

Oh yes, you do not need legal help to get residency but if you wish you can pay a lawyer but don’t necessarily rely on the advice they give??

 

[Graham376]

Update...

Portuguese daughter in law's solicitor friend says we need to have been in Portugal for three months to get residency.

- W

As Nortada says, that's wrong. Plenty of people have had it in a matter of days but some towns such as Faro have long waiting lists for appointments, could be weeks or months.

 

[webcraft]

How long a berthing contract do you need? What constitutes a `contract`?

- W

 

[greeny]

Update...

Portuguese daughter in law's solicitor friend says we need to have been in Portugal for three months to get residency.

- W

Technically I think she's correct. I've seen that written somewhere but can't lay my hands on it right now. However many people I know have not been held to that rule. If asked they just say they've lived here for between 3 and 6 months and are now applying to register their residency. It's not been an issue normally. Just steam ahead with your application and it should go through ok in my experience.
No queue at Lagoa Camara except for the one on the day while you queue to get a ticket then have to stand outside in line until it's your turn to go in. They can be a bit strict on the paperwork though and sometimes ask for proof that you've lived here for a while like electric bill or phone contract. A backdated rental contract would do the same thing. Our local village freguessia (spelling?) has been giving people a statement signed to that effect to help them.
It would appear from reports that Lagos Camara are much easier going and not as pedantic over the paperwork.
If I remember correctly I think Faro have transferred their normally Camara based, temporary residence process to SEF the immigration office and this has resulted in the big backlog and weeks waiting. Don't go to Faro. I believe that after Brexit, all the locales will be doing the same as we will be a "third country" after that date and only SEF will be able to deal with us as non EU citizens.

 

[webcraft]

OK Greeny, so people just usually fib about how long they have been here?

So to do it legitimately, what if I:

Keep all the marina receipts - this will show we arrived in Portugal 20th Sept

Get a one month marina or yard contract somewhere in the Algarve starting (say) 1st December

Apply for residency on 20th December

Have I then jumped through all the hoops? Do I need proof of my pension, and if so what?

- W

 

[greeny]

OK Greeny, so people just usually fib about how long they have been here?

So to do it legitimately, what if I:

Keep all the marina receipts - this will show we arrived in Portugal 20th Sept

Get a one month marina or yard contract somewhere in the Algarve starting (say) 1st December

Apply for residency on 20th December

Have I then jumped through all the hoops? Do I need proof of my pension, and if so what?

- W

My "advice" is to take everything you've got. You never know what they're going to ask for. It depends on what town you're in, what individual you get and what mood they're in that day. No-one can say for sure what the requirement is until you go as an individual and try.
A good example of this was a husband and wife at Lagoa camara a month ago were both at the desk applying for residency. Separate desks, 3 positions apart , different officials. They had exactly the same evidence. Husband was granted residence but his wife was being refused. She called to her husband and told him what was happening. He then asked the man dealing with him, why his wife was being refused although she had exactly the same evidence. The man official stood up and went to the wife's desk position. There were a few terse words passed in Portuguese that they didn't understand. The woman dealing with the wife then changed her tune and gave her the residence. So who knows what you get on the day.
People in Lagoa are being asked for passport, NIF, some sort of evidence that they've lived here for a while, e.g. rental contract, house ownership document, household bills, statement from local fregeussia. They definitely want to see your bank statement (english or portuguese) to see you have funds and if your pension income shows on that so much the better. When I did it with my wife last year we took everything we had including proof of private health insurance, pension documents, mobile phone contracts, internet contracts. We weren't asked for any of those things as she had sufficient "evidence" with the first list.
As far as fibbing goes, most of them have been here for years but have not got rental contracts or other formal evidence of that, living on anchor or living in a friends house maybe. So they just get the statement from the Fregussia to vouch for them. Then they answer the questions the way they think best to get through the hoop.
I think the official rule is that you should register your residence after 3 months and before 6 months .
If I was you, I'd got to Lagos, get your contract there then go to Lagos Camara as they seem to be the easiest going Camara of them all based on the posts and information on here.

 

[nortada]

Technically I think she's correct.

From tons of first hand experience, provided you meet the criteria, you can get temporary residency in Portugal the first day you arrive.

Clearly going for permanent residency or the 'golden visa' are different situations, as are, whether you are visiting the camara or SEF.

My advise would be to chat with somebody in similar circumstances to yours, who has recently got what you want from the agency you plan to visit.

Find out what they want so see and the kind of questions they will ask: then equip yourself accordingly. Remember, your age (+/- 65) and status (working/retired, with/without a state pension), may all have a bearing

I am very aware that different agencies require totally different things so I can only speak of my current knowledge in Lagos.

From a friend who got temporary residency this week. They took, passport, completed application form, proof of accommodation and €15 but no fiscal number - complete success.

One thing the authorities are making it increasingly clear that to to retain your temporary residency, you must reside in Portugal for at least 6 month in every year during your 5 year temporary residency but this requirement does not apply to those who have permanent (10 year) residency.

Before you ask how will they know where you are, your passport is checked every time you enter or leave Portugal. The forthcoming biometric residency permit coupled with the Schengen Database, will make tracking your movements even more easy.

Of course you could remain in the Schengen zone but remember, whenever you leave or enter a marina your whereabouts are logged so the database will have your movements and location pretty much taped.

Very best of luck with your application.

 

[Graham376]

If I was you, I'd got to Lagos, get your contract there then go to Lagos Camara as they seem to be the easiest going Camara of them all based on the posts and information on here.

Seems like the best place to do it although in the meantime you could have a try at Cascais, seems you will be in residence there for some time while engine being fixed. Refusal at Cascais wouldn't effect application elsewhere but don't let it slip that Portugal isn't your new country of residence or refusal is automatic. As far as they're concerned, you intend to stay in the country.

 

[webcraft]

Seems like the best place to do it although in the meantime you could have a try at Cascais, seems you will be in residence there for some time while engine being fixed. Refusal at Cascais wouldn't effect application elsewhere but don't let it slip that Portugal isn't your new country of residence or refusal is automatic. As far as they're concerned, you intend to stay in the country.

The lovely Emma of O'Neill's Irish Pub told me last night that all I need to do is turn up at the and take a ticket for counter 4 of
The Citizen Shop at Lojes de Cascais. Both herself and another of the bar staff at the pub did this. All that was required was an address (she gave the Airbnb she was staying at), passport, bank card and 15 euros.

However, it now seems that thanks to Covid all appointments must be made online. Needless to say, the process for doing so is labyrinthine and incomprehensible, so I am no further forwards at the moment.

- W

 

[Graham376]

The lovely Emma of O'Neill's Irish Pub

The "lovely Emma" and she's given you her address already, hope you're going to pass her details on to us when you leave?

 

[nortada]

The lovely Emma of O'Neill's Irish Pub told me last night that all I need to do is turn up at the and take a ticket for counter 4 of
The Citizen Shop at Lojes de Cascais. Both herself and another of the bar staff at the pub did this. All that was required was an address (she gave the Airbnb she was staying at), passport, bank card and 15 euros.

However, it now seems that thanks to Covid all appointments must be made online. Needless to say, the process for doing so is labyrinthine and incomprehensible, so I am no further forwards at the moment.

- W

Hi Webby,

Think you have just been Portuguesed.

For what it is worth, if you go to The Citizen Shop at Lagos, they refuse to speak English so when asked in Portuguese, they were barely civil and said they would only help Portuguese Citizens Then suggested a visit to the camara, with the rider that in her view the said camara is breaking the rules - I smell dissension in the house or possibly she was having a bad hair day

Looking back to you first post on this thread, are you still on the way to the Canaries? If so when do you hope to arrive?

N

 

[webcraft]

No idea when we are likely to get to the Canaries... we are engineless, broke and waiting to see what develops.

Still no idea whether it will definitely be 90/180 from next year, but may leave the boat in Bruce's for a while anyway.

Re. Portuguese residency - another can of worms seems to be driving licenses. If I get residency then I need to swap my UK license for a Portuguese one before the end of the year. I guess the solution to this is to forget ever driving in Portugal, as I am more likely to need to drive while in the UK.

- W