Loose Footed Main Conversion

dom

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I agree about advantage etc but tried to give summary, likewise about preprep. Our little LM27 feels like its in a storm in gale F7 and rolls like a pig if no mainsail set. I dont expect to make much progress upwind in stronger winds though she is wonderfully buoyant so just need to hold position. I have considered a storm jib but quite frankly without an inner stay all arrangements are problematic and I still wouldnt make much progress

Heavy weather sail is for really for bending on before leaving anchorage or mooring and worked fine when we tried it in strong winds. Has a high cut clew to keep boom well out of way and slab reefing.


Indeed, I think the optimal combo will be different for each individual boat, crew, intended sailing area, etc.
 

lw395

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I have a hybrid foot on the mainsail: a bolt rope for the forward half of the foot, but a very slack and baggy piece of canvas between the bolt rope and the real foot of the sail. That allows for the full adjustment that a loose footed main has, while at the same time retaining the end plate effect of the boom, as no pressure escapes between foot and boom. The sailmaker has provided three reinforced slits where the reefing lines are tied around the boom.
I had never seen this arrangement on another boat, but it was on the original North main with which the boat was equipped when I bought her. I rather liked the idea and when I ordered a new main my sailmaker did not object to fitting a similar system on the loose-footed main he proposed. The slits for the reefing lines have the advantage of keeping the lines in the desired position when they are slacked off
We had one of those.
It's principal effect was to direct rainwater onto the sheet trimmer!
 

Rappey

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After reading all the different point of views in this thread I'm not sure if I now believe in my original post ! Very interesting and sound reasoning from many . A good thread !
Another thought, in boom reefing lines under tension, would that not add some resistance to the boom bending, adding extra strength when load moves to end of boom when reefed? ?
 

richardbrennan

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If you have a stack pack, you may need to modify or replace it if you go to a loose footed main. I did that very thing on the advice of the sailmaker (Kemp) and have had no problems, but the original stack pack was held in place by the bolt rope on the foot of the old main so was replaced.
 

Daverw

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If you have a stack pack, you may need to modify or replace it if you go to a loose footed main. I did that very thing on the advice of the sailmaker (Kemp) and have had no problems, but the original stack pack was held in place by the bolt rope on the foot of the old main so was replaced.
If I did try it out, as the stack pack is held in as you say yours was, could option be to pull a rope through with the stack pack to hold it in place on the boom. Also put a slider on the clew
 

kof

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Sorry but that is just not true. The foot of a main has almost no load on it. Zero, nada, none. You do not need a bigger boom section to have a loose foot. If you did then every sail that was reefed would need one and they don't.

Loose foot concentrates more load at the ends of the boom; the rope slide helps to distribute the load.
 

lw395

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Sorry but that is just not true. The foot of a main has almost no load on it. Zero, nada, none. You do not need a bigger boom section to have a loose foot. If you did then every sail that was reefed would need one and they don't.
Very old designs of sails, the forces might be distributed significantly from the clew.

A more modern sail might make you want to use more vang, which of course makes demands on the boom.
The kind of boats with bolt rope main foot tend to have pathetic kickers and might get by with a skinny boom.
I've even raced with wooden booms.
Best to look at the whole picture.
 

bbg

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This is called a "Letterbox Douse"

it has the advantage that it is much less likely for any part of the spinnaker to end up in the water.., and it can be done while reaching pretty tight with the spinnaker.., without a wiggle down to make the douse easy for the crew

it has the disadvantage that, afterwards, all the lines need to be disconnected from the spinnaker, and if you want to hoist it again, you need to re-run the tapes and reconnect the sheets. On fully-crewed big boats, this is not a problem, as it is common to re-pack the chute after every douse anyway.

I think it is maybe more common with asymmetric chutes than symmetric, because asymmetric, especially if they are on a long sprit, are a bit more likely to end up in the water

it is considered a safe and conservative douse.

I do it a lot on my boat.., with non-sailing guests aboard - they don't need to know anything.., and we get the spinnaker down with no drama. the lazy sheet goes around in front of the mast and through the slot and the crew pulls it as fast as they can. you might instruct them to gather either the foot or the leech first, depending on which you are easing first.
I have never done a douse like that on a big boat - and I have raced on maxis in their heyday.

I know some people use the "letterbox" douse, but I've never seen the need.
 

richardbrennan

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You probably good just secure the stack pack with a length of suitable line, but you would probably need some sort of tail on it to pull it through. Not too difficult to arrange I would think.
 

Laser310

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I have never done a douse like that on a big boat - and I have raced on maxis in their heyday.

I know some people use the "letterbox" douse, but I've never seen the need.

i didn't say it was common on race boats - others said that

i am mostly a racing sailor, and we only occasionally do it on the boats i race on - usually when conditions are a bit tough for the douse, and we want something foolproof.

it's mostly a big boat thing ..,

another reason it might get done, is if you are in big seas and don't want to open a hatch at the bow
 

Daydream believer

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Very old designs of sails, the forces might be distributed significantly from the clew.

A more modern sail might make you want to use more vang, which of course makes demands on the boom.
The kind of boats with bolt rope main foot tend to have pathetic kickers and might get by with a skinny boom.
I've even raced with wooden booms.
Best to look at the whole picture.
Not sure that I agree with that one. Just looking round a typical marina ( well not at present of course) More boats have bolt rope mains than not & many do not have "pathetic kickers".
I raced my first boat for 10 years with a wooden boom, -class rules- It never seemed to be a handicap;)

Although I do agree that the kicker seems to be an ignored piece of kit on many boats, Dodgy old tufnol cleats, thick mouldy ropes etc. . Buy the boat - "Oh! it has a kicker thingy, well pull it in a bit to take up the slack & go sailing.," must be the mantra for some.
So it does depends how owners use them .
 

jwilson

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As Daydream says, most bolt rope mainsail foots (feet?) actually provide very little upward tension at kicker attachment position - this point normally is roughly near maximum draft and there is often loose sailcoth there even with the kicker tensioned, until you slab reef, when you effectively have a loose foot.

To original questioner, ideally the foot of the sail should be recut but it will probably work used loose-footed. I assume the reason is to use a stackpack type cover, which works best with loose-footed mainsails.
 

Daydream believer

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My stack pack does not run in the mainsail groove. There are channels riveted each side of the boom. They are similar to the "P"sections one gets on awnings on caravans. ( probably where they come from) so the type of foot of the main does not become an issue.

I have to say it is infinitely easier to rig a loose fitted or 1/3 foot mainsail, because one can have it furled & tied along its length with sail ties. It can be taken onto the foredeck, Clew engaged by the gooseneck, The sail can remain bound whilst it is slid between the lazy jacks & stack pack, gradually working it aft along the boom. The gooseneck can be engaged. The sail ties can be released & the whole sail will fit neatly in the cover ready to fit onto the mast track.
True one can hoist it up the mast first but not if fully battened & the battens have to go in first. Mine are pushed in from the mast cars so have to go in first. Wind conditions also dictate that one.

If it is a bolt rope sail one side of the stack pack has to be released, It cannot be pre tied up into a bundle. The sail then flops down on the deck & one has to feed the lot into the boom whilst working it along the deck. Worse still if the stack pack goes into the same groove.

I take my sails off every season for storage & maintenance.
 
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