Isle of Wight sealine crash with injuries.

[henryf]

Although our current waters mean that most nights are at marinas and we never drink at sea, we have almost always anchored most nights before that. And we do get very drunk at anchor and once or twice have had to make decisions when an unexpected gust comes in or once when our stern was getting very close to the boat behind.

Like you I would move if I felt an anchorage might be unsafe but that decision would tend to be made 24 hours before. But stopping drinking with the evening meal at anchor (or ashore and dinghy back) would be too big a lifestyle change.

Hi there Rupert

From the outside looking in at your comments it strikes me you might want to consider getting professional help for your drinking problem.

You get very drunk at anchor on a boat that at the best of times needs you alert to spot incidents and potential danger.

Staying sober when there is a chance you might need to move the boat is not an option in your mind.

I really hope we don't read about you as a statistic at some point.

My concern is genuine and not intended as a dig or to be antagonistic. I can tell you first hand that not drinking booze to the point of getting drunk or indeed not drinking at all doesn't preclude you from grabbing life by the horns and having a great time so please don't feel it would be the end of life as you know it.

Good luck

 

[RupertW]

Hi there Rupert

From the outside looking in at your comments it strikes me you might want to consider getting professional help for your drinking problem.

You get very drunk at anchor on a boat that at the best of times needs you alert to spot incidents and potential danger.

Staying sober when there is a chance you might need to move the boat is not an option in your mind.

I really hope we don't read about you as a statistic at some point.

My concern is genuine and not intended as a dig or to be antagonistic. I can tell you first hand that not drinking booze to the point of getting drunk or indeed not drinking at all doesn't preclude you from grabbing life by the horns and having a great time so please don't feel it would be the end of life as you know it.

Good luck

Thanks for your concern but I think it might reflect your experience of booze and boozers rather than mine.
Avoiding getting drunk at anchor would be like avoiding getting drunk at home. It’s where we mostly live when on board.

Cruising isn’t some difficult thing to be approached professionally at all times.

 

[ashtead]

I do wonder if it’s worth much as salvage but I’m no surveyor . it will always be an impaired boat and sea lines are 2 a penny I had thought. I just wonder if insurers will be brave enough to avoid cover though -proving matters at the time might be hard unless say evidence from the establishment visited was available .

 

[LittleSister]

I see nothing entertaining about a serious accident that left people in hospital and which saw emergency services airlifting casualties.

You must live in a very different world to me.

We might all make assumptions as to the cause but until the skipper comes on here or the accident report gets published I would suggest keeping those assumptions to ourselves.

Neither me nor anyone else on the thread has suggested the accident itself was entertaining.

So why you think you live on a different planet to everyone else is a mystery.

I see no good reason people should keep to themselves their views on the potential causes of the accident and how to avoid such eventualities. Especially when you didn't follow your own advice to keep your views to yourself!

 

[ylop]

"Avoiding getting drunk at anchor would be like avoiding getting drunk at home. It’s where we mostly live when on board."

Rupert, lots of people don't get drunk at home, or choose when to get drunk at home. Not just those who are tea-total either - people who are on call for work (or presumably the RNLI etc?), people who know they might need to drive at short notice to a sick/vulnerable relative, people who might need to take a wife to a maternity ward etc. Now I'm not saying I'd never have a glass of wine at anchor, but I certainly wouldn't be getting drunk if the forecast had any possibility of turning bad. Doing otherwise is like parking your campervan, opening the vino knowing that in an hour or two you may have to move it.

 

[paradave]

The PM function is ideal for genuine concern about someone’s health rather than a public post to my mind.

 

[dunedin]

Thanks for your concern but I think it might reflect your experience of booze and boozers rather than mine.
Avoiding getting drunk at anchor would be like avoiding getting drunk at home. It’s where we mostly live when on board.

Cruising isn’t some difficult thing to be approached professionally at all times.

Many / most of us don't choose to get "very drunk" as a pastime, whether at home or on board - well at least once we get past teenage / early twenties stage. Enjoyment of fine wines and beers can be done best in moderation.
Seen so many good people destroy their lives with alcohol.

 

[Momac]

Does anyone know the location of the crash site ? Might help understand how a mistake could have been made

 

[SaltIre]

Does anyone know the location of the crash site ? Might help understand how a mistake could have been made
View attachment 143755

Yes. Somebody visited it and somebody else posted a chartlet with the location marked. If you read earlier posts you'll find them.
Here:
Isle of Wight sealine crash with injuries.
Isle of Wight sealine crash with injuries.

 

[henryf]

Neither me nor anyone else on the thread has suggested the accident itself was entertaining.

So why you think you live on a different planet to everyone else is a mystery.

Ultimately there's no 'point' in waiting for the report, either!

But before the report is eventually produced, why not speculate about what might have happened?

Speculating about the cause of the accident on here is educational, entertaining and harmless, is it not?

I am all for learning from the mistakes of others. Everyday is a school day but I find the thought of deriving pleasure from discussing someone else's suffering a bit macabre particularly when we don’t know their fate. The fact that the police are appealing for witnesses suggests the resulting injuries are very serious, possibly even terminal.

 

[Portofino]

The ones that were hospitalised and admitted at that time early hrs , after an accident would have highly likely had bloods done inc alcohol and other common substances levels .This is to establish a base line incase a general anaesthetic ( ruptured spleen , sub arachnoid haemorrhage etc etc ) and reparative surgery was suddenly needed to resolve issues arising from said trauma .

You need to know what you are dealing with operating , esp the liver re clotting times before the “ flashing blade “ comes out .- surgery .
+Even without any planned surgery you need to know if there are potential adverse reactions or inhibitors to any meds you wish to prescribe .

The walking wounded the two not admitted ( after presume checks ) , then that’s a consent matter between the patient and official Dom , the clinician .

If the skipper or / and helm was one of those admitted then I reckon there’s a note of the then blood alcohol and time taken in the records , along with the other blood test results.

It will all come out in the reports …eventually.I can’t imagine bloods for alcohol + other substances not being done on the two hospitalised and highly likely on the two walking wounded .

 

[SaltIre]

I am all for learning from the mistakes of others. Everyday is a school day but I find the thought of deriving pleasure from discussing someone else's suffering a bit macabre particularly when we don’t know their fate. The fact that the police are appealing for witnesses suggests the resulting injuries are very serious, possibly even terminal.

I think speculating about the cause is educational - but drifting the thread into personal attacks and making flippant, disrespectful comments that the Editors wouldn't publish in Motor Boats & Yachting, isn't harmless. Those injured in the incident can read everything posted - if they are able...

 

[SaltIre]

The ones that were hospitalised and admitted at that time early hrs , after an accident would have highly likely had bloods done inc alcohol and other common substances levels .This is to establish a base line incase a general anaesthetic ( ruptured spleen , sub arachnoid haemorrhage etc etc ) and reparative surgery was suddenly needed to resolve issues arising from said trauma .

You need to know what you are dealing with operating , esp the liver re clotting times before the “ flashing blade “ comes out .- surgery .
+Even without any planned surgery you need to know if there are potential adverse reactions or inhibitors to any meds you wish to prescribe .

The walking wounded the two not admitted ( after presume checks ) , then that’s a consent matter between the patient and official Dom , the clinician .

If the skipper or / and helm was one of those admitted then I reckon there’s a note of the then blood alcohol and time taken in the records , along with the other blood test results.

It will all come out in the reports …eventually.I can’t imagine bloods for alcohol + other substances not being done on the two hospitalised and highly likely on the two walking wounded .

Blood alcohol level is irrelevant to trauma management and isn't done routinely.
Edit: At least it wasn't in the UK before I retired as a Consultant Anaesthetist in 2010.

 

[Portofino]

Blood alcohol level is irrelevant to trauma management and isn't done routinely.
Edit: At least it wasn't in the UK before I retired as a Consultant Anaesthetist in 2010.

The time and socialising aspect of the accident.
More so the ballooning , exponential rise of the CYA medico legally aspect .
Trying to reduce the £2 Bn payouts the NHS makes for medico negligence cases .

 

[paradave]

The time and socialising aspect of the accident.
More so the ballooning , exponential rise of the CYA medico legally aspect .
Trying to reduce the £2 Bn payouts the NHS makes for medico negligence cases .

That's nothing to do with what you said or what SaltIre commented on.

 

[henryf]

Blood alcohol level is irrelevant to trauma management and isn't done routinely.
Edit: At least it wasn't in the UK before I retired as a Consultant Anaesthetist in 2010.

If the police suspect serious injury or death could result from an accident might they request a blood sample from the skipper as part of their preliminary enquiries?

My assumption would be yes, but I’m not an expert in the field.

If nothing else it would protect the skipper in the event they hadn’t been drinking. I enjoyed a fantastic lunch at The Hut on my birthday the other day then motored round to Cowes. None of the bottle of Rose on the bill made it in my direction and I would hate for people to think otherwise in the event of an accident.

 

[SaltIre]

A blood alcohol level is irrelevant when wishing to check coagulation, as stated in #151. It just isn't. It is useful to do tests of coagulation and clotting factors - which are relevant. Nor is it relevant to general anaesthesia. It just isn't.
If the police or NHS Administrators wish to do a blood alcohol level for legal reasons that is an entirely different matter.
I'll now follow the sage advice in #152 and leave others to drift the thread.

 

[Portofino]

That's nothing to do with what you said or what SaltIre commented on.

“admitted at that time early hrs , after an accident would have highly likely had bloods done inc alcohol and other common substances levels”

Agree you wouldn’t do it for a window cleaner with suspected # femur or school boy in a bike crash at 3 pm ( afternoon)

 

[paradave]

“admitted at that time early hrs , after an accident would have highly likely had bloods done inc alcohol and other common substances levels”

Agree you wouldn’t do it for a window cleaner with suspected # femur or school boy in a bike crash at 3 pm ( afternoon)

You're doing it again.

You said "after an accident would have highly likely had bloods done inc alcohol and other common substances levels .This is to establish a base line incase a general anaesthetic ( ruptured spleen , sub arachnoid haemorrhage etc etc ) and reparative surgery was suddenly needed to resolve issues arising from said trauma . "

And this isn't true, as evidenced by an anaesthetist and the fact that PHEA is commonplace without checking bloods first.

 

[Greg2]

If the police suspect serious injury or death could result from an accident might they request a blood sample from the skipper as part of their preliminary enquiries?

My assumption would be yes, but I’m not an expert in the field.

In crimes involving serious injury and hospitalisation good investigative practice is to get early pre-transfusion blood samples so that potential evidence is ‘in the bank.’