INEOS AC 2-0

[Kukri]

Who would ever have imagined that the team to leave an America’s Cup contest with a reputation for good sportsmanship would be ... The New York Yacht Club!

But so it is.

Turned up, tried hard, were competent, had rotten luck, were nice to everyone, lost, went home, with never a bad word.

 

[anoccasionalyachtsman]

The ACE (event organisers) wanted to postpone it. Ineos wanted to postpone it. ETNZ wanted to postpone it. The NZ people wanted to postpone it.

LRPP objected to postponing it, simply (in my view) because they felt that they were on a roll, and clearly don't care about anyone or anything other than winning. Very selfish behaviour which will come back to bite them.

I'm not convinced that ACE (or TNZ) really did. As I implied, a lot of people will be contractually obliged to be elsewhere as of the 25th, and an awful lot more who want/need to be. Who does it really benefit to extend it? Auckland is only under Level 2 restriction - all the private spectator boats are as free to go out as we here were last summer, the village could operate with 'distancing'. Far fewer on the grass, and on the ferries admittedly, but that's hardly the population of NZ. Makes no difference to most watching on screens.

Are you sure that it's not your (and my, and completely forgivable) bias towards Ineos that wouldn't like to give them a few more days practising and tuning?

According to a local, there's no wind due in Auckland tomorrow. Suppose that high stays for a few days? LR win. That would happen anyway, regattas aren't postponed for weather. (Cowes Week a few years ago).

 

[flaming]

Hope you enjoy it. Regrettably the gloss of the event has gone for me. I have the utmost respect for Flaming
and the other serious racers. Unfortunately the content of their posts totally misses Kukri's point about doing
the decent thing and making a good example for the sport, and more importantly young people. Being a professional racing yachtsmen must be great for some but to be a pawn in someone else's game like this for the money does not appeal.

I feel for the LR sailors on Saturday but it would be nice if just one of them walks away. I don't expect I will be the only one after this naïve flutter of interest in the AC now returns to the real world of sailing.

Little confused as to where you think I disagree with Kukri? I don't really.

Reality is that LR have the rules (that everyone signed up to) on their side. ACE have very ham-fistedly tried to publicly shame them into a delay, but all they could ever do really was ask.

My personal opinion is that LR are misguided at best to refuse from a PR point of view, but that the statement from ACE throwing them under the bus is absolutely outrageous. Unlike pretty much all other professional sport, the timing of the races plays a big factor in the outcome due to the weather and the available tuning time. Absolutely fine for the organisers to suggest a change due to circumstances, that's their role, but for the event organisers to then publicly criticise one team for refusing to change the rules that all the teams signed up to half way through the event is, just wow...

Don't forget that there is a large cost to extending on the team who wins. If they push back the date of the Prada cup, and push back the date of the Americas Cup to match, then the team that goes through to the cup suddenly has to rejig all their planned logistics, from extending crew and base staff contracts, to extending crew and staff accommodation, maybe having to extend the lease on their shore compound, potentially rearranging transport logistics to get their boat and kit home, rearranging dates for key sponsors and guests to come and watch the racing (further complicated by quarantine etc).

Nobody is coming out of this looking good, but ACE come out the worst to me.

 

[halcyon]

Little confused as to where you think I disagree with Kukri? I don't really.

Reality is that LR have the rules (that everyone signed up to) on their side. ACE have very ham-fistedly tried to publicly shame them into a delay, but all they could ever do really was ask.

My personal opinion is that LR are misguided at best to refuse from a PR point of view, but that the statement from ACE throwing them under the bus is absolutely outrageous. Unlike pretty much all other professional sport, the timing of the races plays a big factor in the outcome due to the weather and the available tuning time. Absolutely fine for the organisers to suggest a change due to circumstances, that's their role, but for the event organisers to then publicly criticise one team for refusing to change the rules that all the teams signed up to half way through the event is, just wow...

Don't forget that there is a large cost to extending on the team who wins. If they push back the date of the Prada cup, and push back the date of the Americas Cup to match, then the team that goes through to the cup suddenly has to rejig all their planned logistics, from extending crew and base staff contracts, to extending crew and staff accommodation, maybe having to extend the lease on their shore compound, potentially rearranging transport logistics to get their boat and kit home, rearranging dates for key sponsors and guests to come and watch the racing (further complicated by quarantine etc).

Nobody is coming out of this looking good, but ACE come out the worst to me.

End of the day, who if LR win the AC will remember who said what ?

Has Merc gone back to making F1 cars ? we seem to be going back to where we were before their involvement in the boat.

Brian

 

[Wansworth]

If the Italians win we can go and see the event AND eat decent pasta

 

[flaming]

End of the day, who if LR win the AC will remember who said what ?

Has Merc gone back to making F1 cars ? we seem to be going back to where we were before their involvement in the boat.

Brian

I somewhat suspect that INEOS hasn't gone backwards, but LR have gone further forwards.

 

[TernVI]

The ACE (event organisers) wanted to postpone it. Ineos wanted to postpone it. ETNZ wanted to postpone it. The NZ people wanted to postpone it.

LRPP objected to postponing it, simply (in my view) because they felt that they were on a roll, and clearly don't care about anyone or anything other than winning. Very selfish behaviour which will come back to bite them.

The Italians are winning it fair and square according to the rules and NoR which they entered into.
It is entirely normal for a Regatta to have an end date.
You cannot re-write the NoR halfway through just because there's TV money to be made, without the consent of all parties.

 

[Bobc]

The Italians are winning it fair and square according to the rules and NoR which they entered into.
It is entirely normal for a Regatta to have an end date.
You cannot re-write the NoR halfway through just because there's TV money to be made, without the consent of all parties.

They are indeed. They're just not winning many friends along the way.

 

[Bobc]

Better today. The second race showed what they could do if they didn't lose the start.

Hats off the LRPP in the first start. How they managed to slow the boat down like that was incredible. Ben must have thought that he had them until then.

Tomorrow is going to be interesting.

 

[Buck Turgidson]

Better today. The second race showed what they could do if they didn't lose the start.

Hats off the LRPP in the first start. How they managed to slow the boat down like that was incredible. Ben must have thought that he had them until then.

Tomorrow is going to be interesting.

Still trying to understand why the start wasn't recalled as both boats were over early!

Forecast is light winds tonight so it could be all over by the morning.

 

[Bobc]

Still trying to understand why the start wasn't recalled as both boats were over early!

Yes. They said that they both got penalties so they cancelled each other out. I guess it was only because they went through the line at the same time. Only guessing though.

I would have thought that the race would have been binned and re-started, which to my mind would have been fairer, as LRPP were only over because they went up early to shut Ineos out. If they had gone for the line on time, they would have been a couple of boat lengths further down the line, giving Ineos more room.

I wonder what would have happened if Ineos had bailed out at the last minute and not made the line, but LRPP crossing early? Surely then they would have had to recall?

 

[bedouin]

Do they do recalls in this regatta - they might just declare it a penalty and require one boat to drop 50m behind the other as they did of the INEOS penalty.

 

[geoid96]

Do they do recalls in this regatta - they might just declare it a penalty and require one boat to drop 50m behind the other as they did of the INEOS penalty.

From the RRSAC:
44.2 Penalties
(a) OCS Penalties
Penalty for yachts that are OCS:
(i) after her starting signal and while inside the boundary, the penalized yacht
shall act immediately to reduce her VMG / VMC until she is 50 metres behind
the other yacht, or
(ii) the penalized yacht shall start as per definition start (a).

I read this to mean that the OCS yacht can either drop 50m behind other yacht or return and restart. I guess in almost all circumstances the first option will be the least disadvantageous.

 

[ithet]

Seems that Ineos having shown they can only win if they get the start, the starts are going to be even more tactical. With LR now needing to win just 2 they can afford to take risks and be even more aggressive pre-start.

 

[anoccasionalyachtsman]

Seems that Ineos having shown they can only win if they get the start, the starts are going to be even more tactical. With LR now needing to win just 2 they can afford to take risks and be even more aggressive pre-start.

To be fair, race 6 showed that LR can only win if they get the start. Unless it gets shifty that's how it's going to be.

 

[Tomaret]

If the Italians win we can go and see the event AND eat decent pasta

If Ineos UK win we can go and watch and eat Corrie’s Fish and Chips.

 

[ithet]

To be fair, race 6 showed that LR can only win if they get the start. Unless it gets shifty that's how it's going to be.

Yup, or possible light winds. But yes for both it will be the starts.

 

[Kukri]

Spoiler alert.

The better boat won.

 

[Tomahawk]

Spoiler alert.

The better boat won.

Hhmm

 

[anoccasionalyachtsman]

Spoiler alert.

The better boat won.

Not just the better boat. Ben just didn't seem to be on form.