Future used boat prices.

jrudge

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I have no more or less idea than anyone else.

However there are some fundamentals

- new boat prices rise and rise
- the volumes being made new are less than they were 10-15 years ago
- on the flip side boats mostly dont wear out and other than mid cabins not much has changed - so the supply keeps on growing and growing and a boat can be refurbished unlike a car
- given boats dont wear out ( mostly) and the marinas are mostly full ( in the Med anyway) where do these boats go?!

some of the above are in conflict - nut at present were is demand = high prices.
 

oldgit

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Have never seen the yacht brokers in our club car park so frequently.
One boat left today for the brokers pontoon a Princess 415 which needs a lot of work, had been standing for 5 years .
Broom 36 also went the day previously. There are at least 2 or three other boats which will be up for sale very soon.
It appears to be anything that floats. Last month a Coronet 32 sold after only a week , loaded on a lorry and bound for Wales, the cost of transport must have been a fair proportion of what the boat sold for.
This winter has seen the biggest turnover of boats on our moorings since whenever.,Lock down or no Lockdown.
Noticable gaps as you walk up the pontoons.
Most seem to be in that 35-40 foot range, the bigger stuff 50 ft or smaller 25ft seems fairly unaffected.
 

LBRodders

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Definitely a covid effect. Remember the bog roll? :LOL:

Once people's eyes return to foreign jollies, the pressure will be removed from the market.

Plus it seems demand has been generated by newbies dreaming over lockdown. A typical British summer and a few defects will add some reality.

Lastly the money tap can't be far away from being turned off. That will eventually have some effect on everything.
 

James L

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I don't think the money tap will have much of an effect. Not many of those buying boats are going to be getting covid payments.
I know a bunch of people here who have bought boats for the first time and they are all pretty well off and still working.

What I think has happened is they haven't been able to go abroad, haven't been doing much shopping etc and since we live by the sea they've finally given in to a temptation they've always had to buy a boat, since they know they are unlikely to travel again this summer.

Many of them will stick with it if they enjoy this summer. It really depends on the weather this year. And if they do stick with it, more of their friends will join in and buy boats over the coming years.

Hopefully it will push builders to supply more affordable new boats as people are buying them to use as a boat rather than a second home.
Some of the new boats are amazing for the level of luxury they provide but most people can't afford it and don't really need it to head out for a bit of fishing or to stay onboard for a weekend etc.
 

LBRodders

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I don't think the money tap will have much of an effect. Not many of those buying boats are going to be getting covid payments.
I know a bunch of people here who have bought boats for the first time and they are all pretty well off and still working.

The old trickle down effect in reverse - or trickle up.

High earners rely on people at the bottom having money in their pockets, particularly when they are the source of income.
 

Hot Property

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If only 25% of "new entrants" keep their boats then prices will remain firm. I could have sold my boat at a nice profit in the last year but I decided that I enjoy it more than a bigger bank balance.

I recently sold a 14 year old mint condition Honda 5hp outboard for £700 - new with a 5 year warranty they are only £1,100 ish.

Problem is that new outboards are currently sold out in the main, and the secondhand market is the only place to buy....
 

Zing

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Are things not just back to a level that they were in in 2007 pre financial crisis?
Not remotely, except for in the boom areas, particularly the S.E. of England. A property sold today in Manchester for £83,000. It last sold in 2007 for £124,000. There are lots like that. It will take at least another 10 years to recover the lost money at this rate. Also, unlike 2007 there is no credit bubble. People mostly have to buy with hard cash.
 

PowerYachtBlog

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Are things not just back to a level that they were in in 2007 pre financial crisis?
Boating is in a strong position, but with new boats production numbers are also much less to what they where in 2007 but prices have also nearly doubled uo. For example Princess are building 100-120 boats a year from about 200 in 2007. And unlike what many think the size is more or less the same as they where launching the 95 in about that same time, which is currently there biggest offer.
Sunseeker is building 100/120 down from about 200. Fairline is very much a smaller boat builder, and I think they are building like what 30/50 boats a years. They did around 150 in that time.
Cranchi used to build 500/1000 a year now they are at 100/200. Azimut/Atlantis was around 300/400 down to like 250 nowadays.
Ferretti Group was about 300/400 in all the brands now its like 200. Sessa was building 200 boats in that time now they are also building like 50 a year.
These production numbers are the same from 2019 or with little growth from that time.
As a note many small builders in Italy who used to build 10 to 30 boats a year today will build about 5 boats a year, and some have closed there doors while others do refit work.
We also had the growth of the Beneteau Group who has today has really entered into the power boat market not little with Jeanneau / Beneteau / MCY, but also the Hanse Group who today own Sealine / Fjord / who used to build like 200 to 300 boats a year in around 07. Thanks to the varied portfolio of these two I think together they do build like over 1k boats a year.
Upwards of 24 meters the market has been expanding since 2017 (reaching 2008 levels in that year) and is always growing.
 

[2068]

...
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Not remotely, except for in the boom areas, particularly the S.E. of England. A property sold today in Manchester for £83,000. It last sold in 2007 for £124,000. There are lots like that. It will take at least another 10 years to recover the lost money at this rate. Also, unlike 2007 there is no credit bubble. People mostly have to buy with hard cash.


Location is important.
This house is not far away ...


Screenshot 2021-05-14 004714.png
 

Zing

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Another sign of overheating is the order book for Oyster yachts is now over 3 years. Of course, given an recession that can collapse to nothing, but there clearly isn't one there. Something funny is going on and with all the economic collapse from the pandemic too. I find the state of the world economy utterly extraordinary.
 

Farmer Piles

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Just on the property front, here in Cornwall it is ridiculous. I saw a stat the other day along the lines that there are currently more property transactions in Cornwall than in London. Cornwall half a million population, London around 9 million. The same is happening with residential rentals. With home working people are looking to rent and live and work from here. It is pricing youngsters out of all the property market.
Wages are below average down here but rentals and house prices way up. Youngsters down here stand no chance. We have had decades of second home buying pushing up prices but it's mad now. My nephew in his mid thirties left the Coventry area for a good job down here, one of the few, and sold his 3 bed village house; corner plot, big gardens front and back and overlooking fields. All he could afford down here is a scruffy two bed house in the centre of Redruth - a town which a surveyor friend described as a shithole. A bit harsh but you get the picture. It was around £200K
Rant over.
Meamwhile I am just so glad that both my daughters are on the property ladder - bank of Mum and Dad providing the deposits.
 

ontheplane

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Bristol is hot. It's a strong Uni town. Go to Yeovil 35ml south and prices nearly halve.

I work in bath and live between bath and Bristol. We rent a small 2 bed for £950 a month - to buy it would be £250k. For £150k we would struggle to find a 1 bed flat in Hartcliffe (also a sh1thole) but I won’t commute from Yeovil (35m maybe, but an hour and a half commute - (did exactly that commute for 5 months, took 91m door to door leaving at 6:30am, used to get home between 7:30 and 8pm every night....
 

Tony W

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I’m reading here that the mid range 25-40ft mobo‘S are in high demand thus sellers achieving higher than expected sales figure. I’m really pleased for them, genuinely. I’m not sure it’s reflective of boats a little larger, unless I’ve I've been caught in the middle of some shenanigan? Personally I’ve been a little disappointed, my 2008 58 Sq went on the market at £429k, I’ve agreed on a return to me of £340K, so my experience has been a little different, I’m loathed to sell it but circumstances are such. Some you win and some you lose, I’ll be back ?
 
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