Folkboat derivatives

[Judders]

In a bored Tuesday afternoon in September sort of a way, I'm looking for views, experiences, dits and comparisons on the myriad of plastic Folkboat derivatives knocking around boatyards of the UK. Years ago I sailed (with some success) on a plastic Nordic Folkboat and I loved it. At some point in the future I shall be looking to do a low budget JOG season on something with a short waterline (a whole other story) and it'll probably be an Invicta, Contessa 26, Nich 26, Liz 29, Folksong, Folkdancer or some such but of course the only one I've ever sailed is the Nordic.

 

[ProDave]

I have sailed on a Folksong and found it a fine sea boat that sailed well, but the cabin is shall we say, small, even barely room to sit without your head on the coachroof.

 

[Daydream believer]

Quite a few years ago there was a GRP folk boat complete with clinker lands on display at either SIBS or LIBS ( forget which) At the time it was remarkably cheap for a new boat. Even had a trailer. Do not know if it was a success but it looked lovely

 

[johnalison]

The Holman and Pye boats of the time could be considered Folkboat derivatives. That would be the Stella, Twister, Rustler 31, and even 36 perhaps.

 

[JumbleDuck]

I have sailed on a Folksong and found it a fine sea boat that sailed well, but the cabin is shall we say, small, even barely room to sit without your head on the coachroof.

I was going to look at one when I was in the market for my current boat, but abandoned the search when I saw an interior picture of the cabin. A shame, because they are drop-dead gorgeous.

 

[doug748]

I guess that a Nordic Folkboat would suit then, but the expense puts it out of the question?

Most of the British derivatives put on a bit of weight, probably for all sorts of good reasons but they moved away from the sailing experience found in the original. Many of them had a masthead rig, as well. I would say the Cutlass, Nic 26, Liz 29, Twister et al are a fair way from the spirited, fast tacking, sprightly original.

I would look for something around 5000lb displacement with 50% in the keel and a good spread of canvas. The main will be huge so sorted mainsail reefing would be welcome for offshore work. A sprayhood would be a blessing at sea and in harbour. The plastic ones by Eric Berquist have already been mentioned, most were home finished so they vary a lot.
The pick for me would be the International Folkboat. Drawn by Tord Sunden, almost as svelte as the Folkboat but a bit more in the topsides, smooth GRP hull and well put together by Marieholm. You would probably prefer one with an outboard (a lazarette well was standard) which can be lashed to the cabin floor
They tend to be pricy but do come up now and again.

Here is a little blogette from a chap that used to post here:

https://marieholm26.wordpress.com/marieholm-26-the-boat/

His is a Marieholm 26 (different deck, even more topside, smaller cockpit) not an IF boat but it gives you some idea.

 

[Topcat47]

The Sadler 25/26 is also a folk boat derivative. The Nic 26 has full standing headroom though, not something to be sneezed at. They are all pretty cozy below, but I like being able to stand up and not bang my head.

 

[Zagato]

Had a Folksong, it was kitted out by an engineer, he was not impressed by the quality of what was delivered on his drive by Eric Berqist, they didn,t speak after delivery was made. Great boat, but could not sit up in it (owner was a short chap) so I sold it on. I would definitely go for a Marieholm... There is one in Chichester harbour, in a hell of a mess, with weed hanging off it but I saw it out and about last weekend, looks lovely

 

[jwilson]

The Sadler 25/26 is also a folk boat derivative. The Nic 26 has full standing headroom though, not something to be sneezed at. They are all pretty cozy below, but I like being able to stand up and not bang my head.

I like the Sadler 25s/26s, but they really are not any sort of Folkboat derivative: very different hulls/keels.

Hurley 27/Nic 26/Bowman 26/Contessa26/Invicta etc (plenty more) are Folkboat-ish: all very seaworthy but in the effort to give better accommodation many have very narrow sidedecks which I find irritating. Personally I think the Contessa 26 and Invicta are the nicest of these.

 

[JumbleDuck]

I like the Sadler 25s/26s, but they really are not any sort of Folkboat derivative: very different hulls/keels.

There is a general tendency to describe any boat around 25 - 30' and of vaguely traditional appearance as a Folkboat derivative. Credential boosting, I guess.

 

[Daydream believer]

I guess that a Nordic Folkboat would suit then, but the expense puts it out of the question?

Most of the British derivatives put on a bit of weight, probably for all sorts of good reasons but they moved away from the sailing experience found in the original. Many of them had a masthead rig, as well. I would say the Cutlass, Nic 26, Liz 29, Twister et al are a fair way from the spirited, fast tacking, sprightly original.

.

( I accept you left the "get out" by posting "most") I certainly would not suggest that the Stella lost the sailing experience. in fact it more than "enhanced" it, being only a little longer. But far quicker & a fair bit roomier & some would say prettier.
It was the precursor to the successful Twister

 

[jamie N]

As a wooden Folkboat owner, mine's got the standyup space for a 5'10" bloke (near the hatch!). The closest for me is the Stella, which is still true to the sailing qualities, but does have the increased volume inside. The Marieholms look good, but they've a lower coachroof than even mine I believe. Without drifting the thread, many of the home built Folkboats are more cousin than clone by virtue of the builders skill level, and interpretation of the design to preference. Also as an owner, it's impossible to be objective about this; a derivative isn't a Folkboat, and I'm immediately biased against it, which is life!

 

[KINGFISHER 8]

Back in nineteen hundred and frozen to death I had a wooden Folkboat derivative called an Atlefolk built by Shipcrest, of Fareham IIRC ... extra plank in the topsides and less than pretty coach roof - well, not too bad really - same lines as the original FB underwater. Sailed like a witch and somewhat wet! Plenty of room down below and separate heads. Timber under the deck stepped mast was a bit dainty. Bought it for £3k sold it for £4k and had many adventures in between! Always fancied the Marieholm and they made a pretty 32 as well, presumably a scaled up 26.

 

[Seajet]

I've tried to sail every Folkboat design I can.

Best; a low coachroof wooden carvel low coachroof job, sailed like a witch, not too bad an interior for a couple.

I wasn't so keen on the grp Varne which seemed to lack buoyancy forward, very hard mouthed.

 

[doug748]

( I accept you left the "get out" by posting "most") I certainly would not suggest that the Stella lost the sailing experience. in fact it more than "enhanced" it, being only a little longer. But far quicker & a fair bit roomier & some would say prettier.
It was the precursor to the successful Twister

"far quicker"

Well, it will be quick indeed if it can out race a Nordic Folkboat. It's extra weight may come in handy offshore, I am sure the OP will put it on his list.

 

[Judders]

If being literal, the David Sadler derived the Contessa 26 from the folkboat and then derived the Sadler 25 from the Contessa however by the time we have gone from a 3/4 length keel to a fin and skeg arrangement I think it's gone sufficiently far enough from base to be relevant here.

 

[Topcat47]

If being literal, the David Sadler derived the Contessa 26 from the folkboat and then derived the Sadler 25 from the Contessa however by the time we have gone from a 3/4 length keel to a fin and skeg arrangement I think it's gone sufficiently far enough from base to be relevant here.

And the Nic 26 wasn't even a derivative of the original folk boat, but it still gets swept up with them. It's pretty academic anyway, there are few decent 26'ers of the modern era to compare with.

 

[Tranona]

Peter Poland did a pretty comprehensive review of Folkboat derivatives in PBO a few years ago - many of which are actually "in the style of" rather than derived from the original design.

 

[LittleSister]

Folkboat derivatives . . . - many of which are actually "in the style of" rather than derived from the original design.

On the other hand, the 'original design' was itself a derivative! Don't knock derivation too hard.

 

[Tranona]

On the other hand, the 'original design' was itself a derivative! Don't knock derivation too hard.

Not knocking it, but many derivatives became more deviations as they developed and lost some of the essential character of the original (composite rather than derivative) approved design. What prompted my comment was the lineage of the Sadler designs where you can easily see the connection to the contessa 26 and in part the 32, but when the next developments came in the Sadler 24 and 32 there was a clear break in the design philosophy.