Exchange Sails

[Zen Zero]

http://www.exchangesails.co.uk/

Has anyone used them and would like to share their experience?

There's a mainsail I fancy for what seems a reasonable price but then I discovered that VAT needs to be added. Two things surprised me about this - 1. I thought retail prices were supposed to be displayed inclusive of VAT; 2. It's a second hand sail. I assume VAT was paid on the original purchase. Exchange sails have obviously added value by handling it, but should vat be payable at 20% on the full price?

Cheers!

 

[PhillM]

http://www.exchangesails.co.uk/

Has anyone used them and would like to share their experience?

There's a mainsail I fancy for what seems a reasonable price but then I discovered that VAT needs to be added. Two things surprised me about this - 1. I thought retail prices were supposed to be displayed inclusive of VAT; 2. It's a second hand sail. I assume VAT was paid on the original purchase. Exchange sails have obviously added value by handling it, but should vat be payable at 20% on the full price?

Cheers!

I borght a Jib from them. It arrived ontime and was in a better condition than their rating had led me to believe.

I don't have a problem with a plus vat price. It was clear to me when I purchased.

Even second hand goods are subject to VAT.

 

[mdonnelly]

Anybody sold through them? I've a spare spinnaker that is taking up valuable space!

 

[Tranona]

http://www.exchangesails.co.uk/

Has anyone used them and would like to share their experience?

There's a mainsail I fancy for what seems a reasonable price but then I discovered that VAT needs to be added. Two things surprised me about this - 1. I thought retail prices were supposed to be displayed inclusive of VAT; 2. It's a second hand sail. I assume VAT was paid on the original purchase. Exchange sails have obviously added value by handling it, but should vat be payable at 20% on the full price?

Cheers!

VAT is determined by the nature of the transaction. So if you are buying from a VAT registered trader he has to account for VAT on the transaction. If you buy from a private individual there is no VAT even for the same ype of item. It is irrelevant whether VAT has been paid in the past on a transaction involving the same item. It is only the nature of the current transaction that determines if the tax is payable.

 

[Plevier]

VAT is determined by the nature of the transaction. So if you are buying from a VAT registered trader he has to account for VAT on the transaction. If you buy from a private individual there is no VAT even for the same ype of item. It is irrelevant whether VAT has been paid in the past on a transaction involving the same item. It is only the nature of the current transaction that determines if the tax is payable.

Where something has been bought in used from a non registered source, shouldn't VAT just be charged on the profit margin, or is that peculiar to cars and caravans and boats? I bought a boat from a dealer that was his own stock taken in trade in, he wasn't selling as a broker, and I certainly didn't pay VAT on it all. I assume he accounted internally for VAT on the margin (if there was any).

 

[CFarr]

Anybody sold through them? I've a spare spinnaker that is taking up valuable space!

I got £100 per sail I traded in (old hank on headsails) but, it was against the cost of a new genoa so maybe less if only selling?
They loaned me a furling headsail for free too whilst the new one was being made so I could sail her home.
Happy enough.
I did think the addition of vat was not very clearly displayed though.

 

[sailorman]

I borght a Jib from them. It arrived ontime and was in a better condition than their rating had led me to believe.

I don't have a problem with a plus vat price. It was clear to me when I purchased.

Even second hand goods are subject to VAT.

They did not pay VAT on purchase from a private seller, the VAT should only be on their mark-up

Ah just read #5

 

[charles_reed]

Where something has been bought in used from a non registered source, shouldn't VAT just be charged on the profit margin, or is that peculiar to cars and caravans and boats? I bought a boat from a dealer that was his own stock taken in trade in, he wasn't selling as a broker, and I certainly didn't pay VAT on it all. I assume he accounted internally for VAT on the margin (if there was any).

If he wasn't VAT registered he'd have added none and claimed none.
For those dealing with domestic customers there's little benefit in being VAT-rated (for the seller).
Purchasers have the illusion that, if there's VAT added, they're paying more - however any VAT, paid in the chain, is inclusive in the final price.
In the case of cars the value added is only on what the trader adds. It's all in the convention about reporting VAT and many people make a nice living out of the confusion thus engendered.

 

[LadyInBed]

Seateach also do second hand sails: http://www.seateach.com/Mainsails.htm

 

[Plevier]

If he wasn't VAT registered he'd have added none and claimed none.
For those dealing with domestic customers there's little benefit in being VAT-rated (for the seller).
Purchasers have the illusion that, if there's VAT added, they're paying more - however any VAT, paid in the chain, is inclusive in the final price.
In the case of cars the value added is only on what the trader adds. It's all in the convention about reporting VAT and many people make a nice living out of the confusion thus engendered.

Charles
You're confusing it. The question here is what happens when a trade seller who IS vat registered - i.e. Exchange Sails - buys in a used item, on which VAT would originally have been paid, from a seller who is NOT VAT registered, and resells it to a buyer who is NOT VAT registered.
In the case of a car/caravan/boat VAT it is only due on the profit margin.
If that is not the case on other goods then you end up with an item having been VATed more than once which would be unreasonable.
On the face of it, it does not look right if they are adding VAT to the whole selling price as reported.

In fairness to Exchange Sails, their Ts & Cs say "All prices exclude VAT, IF APPLICABLE"
Their Ts & Cs are based on selling your sail at 50% commission, not buying it in and selling it from their stock at all. That's an entirely different VAT case!

 

[helpinghand]

We used them friendly and knowledgeable ,supplied sails recently for rival 41 and repaired my genoa all collected and couriered
Seem well organised and good outfit

 

[Seashoreman]

When a traders annual turnover (not profit) exceeds a certain amount (around about £70,000 at present) you are obliged by law to register to pay vat on all sales, new or secondhand. As far as I know it is only the car/caravan/boat dealers/antiques who get away with vat on profit margins. I spent 12 years struggling to pay vat on second-hand pianos I bought from the public, restored and repolished and sold back to the public. I also sold new, which brought my turnover over the magic figure. I had very little vat claim-back (materials and fuel). They eventually closed that business down and auctioned off my stock to get their value added tax.

 

[Finbar]

I bought a staysail and a storm jib from Exchange Sails and had a poor experience. The are a subset of Westaway Sails, and I dealt with John Pollard. The major problem was an incorrect price charged to my credit card, which I spotted before delivery. It took an age and a great deal of trouble to get this sorted, with lots of promises but very little by way of delivery. The staysail was fine, but I am not happy with the storm jib. It is dimensionally fine, but looks to me like a working jib from a smaller boat with a small triangle of dayglo material stitched to the top. It is certainly not triple stitched and reinforced heavy material, which I expected in a sail described as a storm jib. I did not follow up further with Exchange Sails as by the time I got my refund, my patience was exhausted. My advice would be to only buy when you can personally examine the sail being offered.

 

[2copplane]

I purchased a Genoa off exchange sails (36 footer), it was actually 'new' and they fitted a sacrificial strip as well. The sail was a Westway and perfectly decent and as new, and about half price. My primary gripe was it took a while to arrive and after insisting it was in the post, later rang to confirm which side the sacrificial strip needed to be.

It was 4 years ago so service may hav improved, and I wouldn't be put off using them. Secondhandsails.co.uk, and Seateach seem to hold good stocks as well.

 

[haydude]

1. I thought retail prices were supposed to be displayed inclusive of VAT; 2. It's a second hand sail. I assume VAT was paid on the original purchase. Exchange sails have obviously added value by handling it, but should vat be payable at 20% on the full price?
Cheers!

I think you are right on both questions, cheeky, I would not trust them.

 

[2copplane]

I guess some will be agency, but some such as mine taken in px for a new sail. The new sails price will be lowered and vat reduced accordingly. Therefore he basically has an old sail with nil purchase cost so vat applies on the full amount when sold.

 

[Plevier]

When a traders annual turnover (not profit) exceeds a certain amount (around about £70,000 at present) you are obliged by law to register to pay vat on all sales, new or secondhand.

That's partly right, but wrong if you mean VAT on the full value of second hand sales.
Look up the VAT Margin Scheme.
If you are buying in something used (originally VAT paid) and reselling you pay VAT only on the margin.
If you sell for someone on commission you pay VAT on the commission only.
As Exchange Sails charge 50% commission (acc to their website) there will be VAT on half the selling price.
If they are selling one taken in part exchange as they also do, VAT on the margin only.
The selling price should be stated including VAT or there should be a clear notice that VAT is extra, either will do.

 

[stevd]

Unfortunately, so far, I have had really poor service from Exchange Sails. I ordered from them, after seeing mainly positive feedback for them. I was hoping I was going to be able to come back and give positive feedback.

I ordered a headsail at the beginning of Feb. They had one described as 8 out of 10, with near perfect dimensions. Unfortunately it didn't have a UV strip so I paid Exchange Sails to put a new one on for me. I was told to expect delivery in approximately 10 days as they would clean the sail and add the UV strip. The time had passed; I hadn’t heard anything, so I chased them up. I was told they hadn’t fitted the UV strip as yet, but it was there next job. After 5 weeks, I called to chase it again. I was told the sail was ready for dispatch, but hadn’t been sent, but it would be sent via courier that day. Another week passed, still hadn't received anything. They chased it with the courier, apparently it had been sent to the wrong hub, the couriers mistake (I am now unsure if it had even been sent or not) they said it would be returned to them, and they would re-send it.

Today a sail arrived. But it clearly isn’t the sail I have ordered. It has a well used UV strip on it, and it is very poor in a dirty un-laundered condition.

I am now awaiting a call back..... I really hope they come up with a satisfactory solution! I will come back with the outcome.

 

[charles_reed]

That's partly right, but wrong if you mean VAT on the full value of second hand sales.
Look up the VAT Margin Scheme.
If you are buying in something used (originally VAT paid) and reselling you pay VAT only on the margin.
If you sell for someone on commission you pay VAT on the commission only.
As Exchange Sails charge 50% commission (acc to their website) there will be VAT on half the selling price.
If they are selling one taken in part exchange as they also do, VAT on the margin only.
The selling price should be stated including VAT or there should be a clear notice that VAT is extra, either will do.

I don't think anyone is confused that they should be only charging VAT on the difference on the purchase-price (if from a non-VAT seller) and their total sales price.
It would be interesting to see if they do make this distinction on their VAT returns.

 

[stevd]

Apparently, they have sent the wrong sail and the correct one will arrive tomorrow. I am a little skeptical, but I really really hope that is the case. So I am going to fully inspect it tomorrow.