Eel Grass and Anchoring in Cawsand Bay, Cornwall

[moomba]

You are still catching up - there is nothing new in what you say here. Suggest you actually read the studies on anchoring in the med before you suggest they have any relevance to the issues (if there is an issue at all) in the UK.

The fact is that none of the studies in the UK have identified anchoring as an issue. Many would like it to be and have stated that it does, but without any evidence to support their claims.

But then we are going over old ground. If you claim decisions should be based on evidence then you need the evidence. If there is no evidence do not make the claims.

Please read my full quote, you seem to constantly argue with my biological knowledge in science In which I believe you have non, I clearly stated that you can make correlations between two species , although they are different in which I have pointed out ,I am not going to list over 20 papers written in scientific literature from the med.
And as a scientific researcher I do believe that I am more informed than yourself and do keep up to date.
My argument was well balanced and fairly written , you seem to have issues with the facts.

 

[Tranona]

Please read my full quote, you seem to constantly argue with my biological knowledge in science In which I believe you have non, I clearly stated that you can make correlations between two species , although they are different in which I have pointed out ,I am not going to list over 20 papers written in scientific literature from the med.
And as a scientific researcher I do believe that I am more informed than yourself and do keep up to date.
My argument was well balanced and fairly written , you seem to have issues with the facts.

I did read it and don't agree with your opinion. You have not given any balanced argument - only your opinion and claim it is valid because you are a researcher in a related area.

Just to remind you that I held a senior position in a major UK university for 25 years or so supervising postgraduate research. I think I am quite capable of making up my own mind about the transferability of research from one situation to another.

I am not knocking your claimed knowledge on the subject, just your seeming lack of critical assessment.

If you want to stick to facts then just recognise that there is currently no evidence that anchoring causes long term damage to eel grass in UK waters.

 

[moomba]

I did read it and don't agree with your opinion. You have not given any balanced argument - only your opinion and claim it is valid because you are a researcher in a related area.

Just to remind you that I held a senior position in a major UK university for 25 years or so supervising postgraduate research. I think I am quite capable of making up my own mind about the transferability of research from one situation to another.

I am not knocking your claimed knowledge on the subject, just your seeming lack of critical assessment.

If you want to stick to facts then just recognise that there is currently no evidence that anchoring causes long term damage to eel grass in UK waters.

Mr T that is like saying Iam a senior lecture in biology , but I know more about Maths come on Sir you know fine well that in academia each discipline has its own ways of referencing , what To expect and what sound basic scientific wording, and knowledge should be used, you have no biological expertise in written these papers , and referencing These papers , you constantly argue my points in any discussion on ecology biological process , even though as stated many times My wife is a Dr of Fresh water Ecology , and is part of the EU water Frame work Directive, and I have been a marine biologist for the last 20 years.
Yet you still argue your point , with critical thinking , you forget and has been pointed out ot you before we as biological scientists look to prove the Null Hypotheses , we can use data from other sources , conduct our own experiments or do a literature review of the available knowledge and we then can try and prove the Null
Please again I ask you to stop telling me I have it wrong, if so I wouldn't have had a job.
I know you like to argue your point but accept your wrong sometimes its good for the soul.


Now these are some selected papers from Canada to Morocco to France and Croatia ,they all show the impact on anchoring and stresses on the eel grass , now as a UK scientist we can take that data and extrapolate that this MIGHT
happen around the coasts of the UK hence why there is now a substantial look at the Grasses around the UK,.

clearly they are not the same species but belong to the grass family. so maybe a little more study is needed for the UK , but It is like saying Orcas and not being polluted by PCBS but Blue whales are,they both belong to the same family so it would be fair to say in an hypotheses that both creatures will be affected.
It makes me wonder if those that think the UK eel grass beds are different to the rest of the World or is this the usual British cant be told anything.

Effects of boat anchoring in Posidonia oceanica seagrass beds in the Port‐Cros National Park (north‐western Mediterranean Sea)


Monitoring environmental impacts of recreational boat anchoring on eelgrass(Zostera marina L.) and benthic invertebrates in the Gulf Islands National Park Reserve

Recolonization of intertidal Zostera marina L.(eelgrass) following experimental shoot removal

Environmental Impacts of Recreational Boating in the Gulf Islands National Park Reserve of Canada

Rocking the boat: damage to eelgrass by swinging boat moorings

Patch dynamics of eelgrass Zostera marina

Assessment of the ecological status of Mediterranean French coastal waters as required by the Water Framework Directive using the Posidonia oceanica Rapid Easy

Environmental impact identification along the Corsican coast (Mediterranean sea) using image processing

Assessing the Environmental Impact of Anchoring Cruise Liners in Falmouth Bay

Means of rapid eelgrass (Zostera marina L.) recolonisation in former dieback areas
Effects of marine protected areas on recruitment processes with special reference to Mediterranean littoral ecosystems

 

[RupertW]

Mr T that is like saying Iam a senior lecture in biology , but I know more about Maths come on Sir you know fine well that in academia each discipline has its own ways of referencing , what To expect and what sound basic scientific wording, and knowledge should be used, you have no biological expertise in written these papers , and referencing These papers , you constantly argue my points in any discussion on ecology biological process , even though as stated many times My wife is a Dr of Fresh water Ecology , and is part of the EU water Frame work Directive, and I have been a marine biologist for the last 20 years.
Yet you still argue your point , with critical thinking , you forget and has been pointed out ot you before we as biological scientists look to prove the Null Hypotheses , we can use data from other sources , conduct our own experiments or do a literature review of the available knowledge and we then can try and prove the Null
Please again I ask you to stop telling me I have it wrong, if so I wouldn't have had a job.
I know you like to argue your point but accept your wrong sometimes its good for the soul.


Now these are some selected papers from Canada to Morocco to France and Croatia ,they all show the impact on anchoring and stresses on the eel grass , now as a UK scientist we can take that data and extrapolate that this MIGHT
happen around the coasts of the UK hence why there is now a substantial look at the Grasses around the UK,.

clearly they are not the same species but belong to the grass family. so maybe a little more study is needed for the UK , but It is like saying Orcas and not being polluted by PCBS but Blue whales are,they both belong to the same family so it would be fair to say in an hypotheses that both creatures will be affected.
It makes me wonder if those that think the UK eel grass beds are different to the rest of the World or is this the usual British cant be told anything.

Effects of boat anchoring in Posidonia oceanica seagrass beds in the Port‐Cros National Park (north‐western Mediterranean Sea)


Monitoring environmental impacts of recreational boat anchoring on eelgrass(Zostera marina L.) and benthic invertebrates in the Gulf Islands National Park Reserve

Recolonization of intertidal Zostera marina L.(eelgrass) following experimental shoot removal

Environmental Impacts of Recreational Boating in the Gulf Islands National Park Reserve of Canada

Rocking the boat: damage to eelgrass by swinging boat moorings

Patch dynamics of eelgrass Zostera marina

Assessment of the ecological status of Mediterranean French coastal waters as required by the Water Framework Directive using the Posidonia oceanica Rapid Easy

Environmental impact identification along the Corsican coast (Mediterranean sea) using image processing

Assessing the Environmental Impact of Anchoring Cruise Liners in Falmouth Bay

Means of rapid eelgrass (Zostera marina L.) recolonisation in former dieback areas
Effects of marine protected areas on recruitment processes with special reference to Mediterranean littoral ecosystems

Any links ?

 

[moomba]

Any links ?

The best way to access scientific papers is type in google scholar in your search engine , and then you can put these titles in the search bar or put in key words like eel grass ,med, etc
Some Papers will only allow access to abstract which summaries the whole paper were others will give you full access. if you have a student or a sibling or know someone in academia then you can use their log in details from their University which in most cases can give you full access to all papers.

 

[Heckler]

The best way to access scientific papers is type in google scholar in your search engine , and then you can put these titles in the search bar or put in key words like eel grass ,med, etc
Some Papers will only allow access to abstract which summaries the whole paper were others will give you full access. if you have a student or a sibling or know someone in academia then you can use their log in details from their University which in most cases can give you full access to all papers.

You are continually being quoted by the Bournemouth Echo?
https://www.bournemouthecho.co.uk/n...n_to_give_out_plastic_bottles_at_beach_clean/ and are part of the Studland Bay group? so why do you put in your bio that your location is Glasgow?

 

[Tranona]

Now these are some selected papers from Canada to Morocco to France and Croatia ,they all show the impact on anchoring and stresses on the eel grass , now as a UK scientist we can take that data and extrapolate that this MIGHT
happen around the coasts of the UK hence why there is now a substantial look at the Grasses around the UK,.

clearly they are not the same species but belong to the grass family. so maybe a little more study is needed for the UK , but It is like saying Orcas and not being polluted by PCBS but Blue whales are,they both belong to the same family so it would be fair to say in an hypotheses that both creatures will be affected.
It makes me wonder if those that think the UK eel grass beds are different to the rest of the World or is this the usual British cant be told anything.

You now have the magic word "MIGHT" in there. Well, yes they might have something to offer - but they don't. It is not a question of ignoring them, but considering them and coming to the conclusion that they are not directly relevant. If you read the BORG papers you will find most, if not all of those papers are referenced. You will also find them referenced in a couple of the dubious studies that have tried to assess any damage from anchoring in Studland.

So nobody involved in the eel grass "scene" in the UK has ignored them - just found they are not relevant.

Research starts from common sense. Long before you get to your "null hypothesis" or trying to "prove" anything, you need to ask some basic questions.

Is there a problem - what is it? Do we have any knowledge about it? etc etc.

I won't go on because you can read any basic book on research methods to go through the rest of the process.

With Studland, nobody followed this process. The whole charade was started by one person making claims that anchoring was damaging the beds and the habitat was declining - without any evidence except a couple of dubious photos and a loud voice. Everybody else with knowledge of the bay said it was not true and the beds were expanding - and had been for many years.

Since then nobody has come up with any credible evidence to support the original claims, nor has anybody else (including in the case that is the subject of this thread) found any evidence of anchor damage in the many other beds in UK waters.

So, it does not matter how many papers you cite about damage in the Med or anywhere else the fact is that on the evidence so far pleasure boat anchoring does not cause long term (or even significant short term) damage to UK eel grass beds.


Please forget about all your maths and null hypothesis and use some common sense. This is not about how clever you can make your research project nor how you can boost the scores on your paper by referencing other papers. This is about the real world where science can help us understand IF you ask the right questions in the first place.

 

[rotrax]

You now have the magic word "MIGHT" in there. Well, yes they might have something to offer - but they don't. It is not a question of ignoring them, but considering them and coming to the conclusion that they are not directly relevant. If you read the BORG papers you will find most, if not all of those papers are referenced. You will also find them referenced in a couple of the dubious studies that have tried to assess any damage from anchoring in Studland.

So nobody involved in the eel grass "scene" in the UK has ignored them - just found they are not relevant.

Research starts from common sense. Long before you get to your "null hypothesis" or trying to "prove" anything, you need to ask some basic questions.

Is there a problem - what is it? Do we have any knowledge about it? etc etc.

I won't go on because you can read any basic book on research methods to go through the rest of the process.

With Studland, nobody followed this process. The whole charade was started by one person making claims that anchoring was damaging the beds and the habitat was declining - without any evidence except a couple of dubious photos and a loud voice. Everybody else with knowledge of the bay said it was not true and the beds were expanding - and had been for many years.

Since then nobody has come up with any credible evidence to support the original claims, nor has anybody else (including in the case that is the subject of this thread) found any evidence of anchor damage in the many other beds in UK waters.

So, it does not matter how many papers you cite about damage in the Med or anywhere else the fact is that on the evidence so far pleasure boat anchoring does not cause long term (or even significant short term) damage to UK eel grass beds.


Please forget about all your maths and null hypothesis and use some common sense. This is not about how clever you can make your research project nor how you can boost the scores on your paper by referencing other papers. This is about the real world where science can help us understand IF you ask the right questions in the first place.

Well said. Sums it up quite nicely.

And accurately!

 

[Heckler]

Well said. Sums it up quite nicely.

And accurately!

And if he wants to continue with his fantasizing, ask him to go to Culatra in the Rio Formosa, where anchoring is encouraged by the authorities and where the eel grass is growing even more in the anchoring area and because of this reports of anchors not setting properly are increasing! Good scientific proof according to his standards!