Docking & engine room cameras

[Gentlemanracer]

So IP cameras are the way ahead and I see that Raymarine resellers are looking for over £400 per camera, yet similarly specified devices are available less than half that price. The delta mounts up! Ray documentation states (even with ONVIF compliance) no compatibility guarantee with non Ray devices. Seems an obvious caveat, I guess, but I'm keen to know if anyone here or about has successfully used a non Ray IP camera with a Ray MFD (hybrid touch, ideally) successfully? Or any other IP marine applications wisdom welcome!

 

[Ian MacAulay]

i Believe my E series has a analogue video input so i would of thought any camera with a analogue video would be ok but I'm not sure on ip cameras

 

[rlw]

I have a car reversing camera hooked up to my Garmin plotter. Fitted into an air scoop. Works a treat.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Night-Visio...674026?hash=item58c126e62a:g:IaIAAOSwnDZT4KgU

 

[Hurricane]

I know that indeed, ONVIF is a big issue.
No actual experience of my own but I know someone who has the knowledge and experience of this combination.
I think some of the problems are DHCP thus IP address related.

EDIT
My docking cameras are "old fashioned" RGB technology but my Anchor Cam is a cheap IP camera.
I'm not sure that IP cameras ARE necessarily the way to go.
Their very nature is to "stream" the video so there is a small delay - maybe you are happy with a delay.

 

[Gentlemanracer]

Responses very much appreciated and Mike, I had not figured a response delay. I need any and all of that for me (!) so, for my stated uses, less technology & much less budget gets me more of what I need. Thanks again, off to find the final answer.

 

[jfm]

I can see the logic for IP cameras over a wide network but on a closed small thing like a boat I prefer analogue "old fashioned" cameras, and that's what I have. I find them completely reliable and the lack of buffering delay is reasonably critical when docking or using an AnCam. If you want more cameras than you have inputs for on your MFD, you can buy splitters etc on eBay. The components are cheap and when they fail you can chuck them away and pull another off your spares shelf. And you don't spend your life faffing with IP addresses and other settings just to get them working.

 

[vas]

I can see the logic for IP cameras over a wide network but on a closed small thing like a boat I prefer analogue "old fashioned" cameras, and that's what I have. I find them completely reliable and the lack of buffering delay is reasonably critical when docking or using an AnCam. If you want more cameras than you have inputs for on your MFD, you can buy splitters etc on eBay. The components are cheap and when they fail you can chuck them away and pull another off your spares shelf. And you don't spend your life faffing with IP addresses and other settings just to get them working.

+1000

having spent the last couple of days sorting out specs for an ip camera system for the university admin bldg, the whole mess involved is definitely viable in a 5K sqm bldg, but totally nuts on 15-20m runs of a typical mobo or sailing boat... IP cameras also have extra issues when recording and keeping video data, but I doubt anyone cares about that, I do wonder if anyone does it btw!

cheers

V.

 

[superheat6k]

I have a car reversing camera hooked up to my Garmin plotter. Fitted into an air scoop. Works a treat.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Night-Visio...674026?hash=item58c126e62a:g:IaIAAOSwnDZT4KgU

Does this camera reverse (or mirror) the image as an installed reversing camera does, if so can this feature be turned on and off ?

I fancy one for the engine room but would like to see the true image not a mirror image.

 

[bluetooth]

What about this one ?
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Parking-ad...coding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=F96YZTQ43763158END45

The 360 movement looks good. I am keen to fit one for docking.
Cheers

 

[prv]

What about this one ?
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Parking-ad...coding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=F96YZTQ43763158END45

The 360 movement looks good. I am keen to fit one for docking.

I have something very similar in my rear bumper for reversing the car - works fine for that.

Not sure why you're so impressed with the 360º rotation though - all it means is "the camera is round, you can put it in a round hole any way up"

Pete

 

[prv]

Also, a slight tangent on the subject of engine room cameras. Are IR cameras useful for this purpose (I imagine being able to spot things like overheating gearboxes, or even fire) and do they work with the engine room lights off?

Cheers,

Pete

 

[bluetooth]

Pete
I struggle to see the port stern quarter from starboard helm position (and wife refuses to give any meaningful timely information); S/b stern quarter is not a problem. I am therefore keen to ensure the camera can be hidden on port side and then "wiggle" the lens to the best position - hence the extra movement. Trying to avoid using radar arch given the grief of wiring job involved although this no doubt gives optimal view.
Cheers, BT

 

[rlw]

Hi Superheat,

To be honest I am not sure. I think it did but that the garmin plotter has a setting to mirror it back.

Rob

 

[Andrew M]

Also, a slight tangent on the subject of engine room cameras. Are IR cameras useful for this purpose (I imagine being able to spot things like overheating gearboxes, or even fire) and do they work with the engine room lights off?

Cheers,

Pete

Yes, We've got an IR camera in the engine room, it gives a pretty good view of both engines up the centre line and you'd spot if there was any smoke or fire (if you were watching it of course).

It works well with engine room lights either on or off. If you are putting an engine room camera in you might want to think about how you actually monitor it when motoring. Ok if you've got enough plotter space, we've got 2 on each helm so if I want to I can have 1/4, 1/2 or a whole of 1 screen devoted to cameras but if I was working on 1 plotter I don't think a camera view would be priority info for me. Maybe if you have smoke detectors and one goes off then an instant camera view would then be a 1st good check.

 

[Hurricane]

Some experiences of docking cameras after 9 years.

I fitted our stern cameras when the boat was new.
I didn't like the Raymarine cameras that were on offer at the time - IMO looked ugly and were very expensive.
I also couldn't get a good view of the whole of the boat's stern.
So, I chose two low cost RGB dome cameras and fitted them in the underside of the flybridge overhang.

We have 2 displays at each helm position (the system is a G Series glass bridge - the displays are, in fact, monitors with provision for several inputs)
So, I fed the two docking cameras into each display.
The idea was that I could have each display connected to each camera and see both sides of the stern at the same time.
That presented a problem.
Should the port display monitor the port and the starboard camera monitor the starboard or should they switch round so that they are the same orientation when looking backwards?
Then, should the images be inverted?
So I wired both camera feeds to all the monitors so that I could select whatever option I wanted.

In fact, Raymarine also offer me another option - put both cameras on a single monitor at the same time and join the images up.
the principal can be seen here - only one docking camera shown on this pic but I think you can see what I mean.

So, after 9 years, what have I actually done.
Very quickly, the solution was to have the port display monitor the port and the starboard camera monitor the starboard - in my mind I can easily "think" to look at that side for that camera - if you know what I mean.

So, do I use them.
It takes quite a bit of time to get used to them.
But, essentially, yes, I do use them.
To begin with, I set them up and forgot to actually use them - relying on people shouting instructions - remember the boat was very new and I was learning loads of other stuff.
As I say, it takes time to trust the image but after a while it becomes quite natural to look at them.
So, in general, I say it is well worth fitting.
In my case, we carry a dinghy on the top of the flybridge which definitely obstructs the rear view.
An alternative option would be to have a third control station in the cockpit - in which case docking cameras wouldn't be required.
Personally, though, I still prefer to control the boat from the flybridge - watching the bow is just as important to me - especially when docking in our home berth where too much movement on the bow could swing round into the floating dock's finger pontoon.

Anyway, to finish up this post, I have a few more pics that you might find interesting (already on Photobucket)

The system is set up so that a single button press gets this view.

There is also a PIP (Picture in Picture) view but I've never used it - usually I just press the single button on each monitor for a single image (above).

Just my experiences.
Hope you find this post helpful.

 

[Blue Sunray]

Also, a slight tangent on the subject of engine room cameras. Are IR cameras useful for this purpose (I imagine being able to spot things like overheating gearboxes, or even fire) and do they work with the engine room lights off?

Cheers,

Pete

I think there may be some confusion in many people minds between 'near' and 'far' IR systems, the latter normally being termed 'thermal'. Most IR cameras on the market are 'near' IR systems often with built in IR illumination which can work well over relatively short ranges and in particular interiors eg engine rooms, but would not pick up hot spots in the same way as a far IR/thermal system

This gives a pretty succinct explanation: https://www.beneaththewaves.net/Phot..._Infrared.html

and a demo of sorts

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IM0pt3wObJc

 

[prv]

I think there may be some confusion in many people minds between 'near' and 'far' IR systems, the latter normally being termed 'thermal'. Most IR cameras on the market are 'near' IR systems often with built in IR illumination which can work well over relatively short ranges and in particular interiors eg engine rooms, but would not pick up hot spots in the same way as a far IR/thermal system

Thanks, that's useful to know, especially the comparison video. This is actually for work rather than my boat and I'm not certain what the electrical guys have specced, but I suspect it'll be near IR hopefully with illumination. That should do the job we need although thermal would have been a bonus.

Pete

 

[fisherman]

Also, a slight tangent on the subject of engine room cameras. Are IR cameras useful for this purpose (I imagine being able to spot things like overheating gearboxes, or even fire) and do they work with the engine room lights off?

Cheers,


Pete

I hear that FVs with engine room cameras have been getting discounts on insurance, might be worth asking. They are usually part of a split screen system for monitoring work areas, winches etc.

 

[Gentlemanracer]

Got a bit bogged down looking at analogue cctv camera choices. Much attention is now on HD over 75 Ohm co-ax, but you need a DVR to decode it before sending it to on an MFD or other screen / tablet. The upshot is when you (eventually) find a genuine SD analogue camera, its not expensive. More later!

 

[HambleDom]

Regarding the OP about IP cameras I too had planned to install some as my winter project.
However the issue is that every IP camera I have found (that is not Raymarine) requires a username and password authentication. So whilst you can buy cameras that are fully ONVIF S compliant, and meet all the technical requirements for the Raymarine MFD the current software on the MFD does not provide for you to enter the username and password.

So I resorted to the old fashioned BNC connection.
I bought 2 of these for less than £50 each.
https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/TSHDVC36FD.html
They are IP66 (ingress protection) and highly configurable (mirror, flip,HD, SD etc)
I particularly wanted grey because of the location on the boat but they make them in white also.
Attached photo - sorry it's a crop from a bigger shot.
Port and Starboard sides both in and working perfectly with the MFD, IR works nicely too.