Change and decay in all around I see.

Kukri

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Well whats caused the Changes and the Decay of Boating in general

Might offer a personal opinion as to another cause thats not been mentioned , but is apparent in some poster comments , that of change of type of person who has become interested in boating , but lacks any history or understanding of Boating , its rights and wrongs , its historical Rights etc .
Sort of person with the understanding or lack of , that compares Boating with , say car ownership and rules , apparent sometimes with comments like , well someone will gain so why cant they charge , we have licences to drive cars so why not boats , why have free moorings , why should etc etc

The subject of the Brightlingsea yard wanting to have /take away a public right of way , the different opinions do show quite well how the differences unfortunately uch apparent

I stated in a post about the RYA a long time ago , that I think us boaters really need a strong forcefull person /organisation that will fight for the various Rights Of Way and Access to be retained for our public use , a Organisation similar to the Ramblers Associoation who will take on Commerce , Companies , Governments etc etc ; Unfortunately the present Boating Interest Organisations would appear lacking in commitment , maybe they are ex Civil Serv etc who have no built in personal policy of Right n Wrong

I strongly agree with Captain Popeye.

The history and traditions of our sport are a part of it; we enjoy it more if we know what they are and that we are observing them.

If you “clear out all the old nonsense”, what have you got left?

And I think Popeye is right that really there isn’t anyone who really takes care of the public’s rights as regards salt water and access to it. Neither the RYA nor the CA really have it as one of their main functions. Trinity House used to, but they don’t have the resources, now.
 

Cobra

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So are you saying that if the pontoons do not extend beyond MLWS, it would get general approval and support?
If so perhaps we can get Morgans to look at the design?
By George! I think he's got it!

Sadly, I think that the new owners of Morgans may have misinterpreted what the original plan was and hence all the furore currently going on.

FWIW I honestly think that a continuation of the pontoons at MLWS (ie in line with the current pontoons) would be no bad thing and would hopefully ease the situation for those of us who actually prefer to be moored in the river for its peace and quiet and yet still benefit from a pontoon to moor alongside...a situation that is drastically oversubscribed at present!
 

Daydream believer

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Once a site is allocated for development in the Local Plan, the rest is a formality. Planning officer cannot refuse planning consent on the ground they do not like something they have proposed and adopted. One only has to look at the sites being built out that are allocated for housing in various local plans to understand effect of that. What do I know? I used to work in Town Planning
I have just spent a fortnight sailing with one of the chief finance persons dealing with the issue & that is nothing like his description. The council put forward 9 major projects, all with outline proposals agreed at consultation & then 7 of them stopped at the final hurdle. due to Planning changing their mind. He says the frustration in the council at the wasted time & effort is beyond belief.
 

old_doozer

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I am not sure why Tomahawk (7 metre wide catamaran kept on the Morgan's pontoons) thinks that his boat is any more meritorious of a right to navigate than the "non-sailing boats" at St Osyth Boatyard (actually numerous sailing boats also use this yard for winter storage and the larger ones can only get to the yard using the North channel and through the cut between the Cindery Islands due to the large number of moorings in the South Channel) or the so called "cheap boats" at Underwood's Hard - which include the historic 1890's police boat "Victoria" and the beautiful Essex Oyster Smack "Harriet Blanche" (CK9) which are both engineless, or my own Mevagissey Tosher, should be prevented from using the creek other than an hour or so either side of high tide because Morgans want to take 24 metres of publicly navigable water just for their own commercial gain.

They claim that there will still be 20.4 metres (at L.A.T.) of navigable water left for the rest of us to play on - but that distance, as shown on their planning application documents is measured to the 1 metre DRYING contour on their own bathymetric survey! I don't know any boat that can navigate in minus 1 metre of water! Morgan's planning application documents are fundamentally flawed and cannot simply be taken at face value.

Our independent survey taken last Monday when Brightlingsea Harbour Commissioners laid out some buoys to demonstrate the position of the pontoons proves that there will actually be no more than 12 metres left for everybody else to use. And the deepest water in the fairway will be completely obstructed by any boats laying on those outer pontoons. So whilst Tomahawk may actually remain afloat 24/7 on the outer pontoon he still won't be able to leave his berth at low tide because there won't be enough room to turn round in.

The moorings at Underwood's Hard are at or near the water's edge at low tide in order to comply with local harbour byelaws which prohibit anchoring in the fairway. The existing Morgan's pontoons are at mean low water mark for precisely the same reason.

With a draft of 0.8 m I can get on/off my swinging mooring at Underwood's Hard at 1 hour either side of mean low water (a bit later on spring tides) but, once off that mooring can sail in the creek, from there downwards, at any state of the tide (always assuming a great big catamaran isn't hogging the deepest water in the fairway on its pontoon mooring in the middle of the creek). But if there is any easting or westing in the wind it will not be possible to do so as, with a 6 metre long boat, I need more than 2 boat lengths in which to build up enough speed to tack and carry my long keeled craft through the eye of the wind without either running aground on Cindery Island or kebbabing his catamaran with my bow sprit! Please see video here of creek surveying

Of course Tomahawk doesn't see many sailing boats going by around low tide because none of Morgan's pontoons are accessible at that time so he isn't down there. But I often am - sailing by in a little dinghy to get to my boat at the water's edge. I also see various kayakers, paddleboarders and the occasional dinghy, under sail, oars or motor, out and about at that time, as well as at all other states of tide.

The local rowing gigs from the Coastal Rowing Club also frequently use the creek, particularly in windy weather, for training and racing, including at low tide. These gigs are 8 metres wide from oar tip to oar tip and need a minimum depth of 18-24 inches of water so as not to damage the ends of the oars catching the bottom. When racing they need a minimum width of about 18 metres (2 x oar widths plus a bit) more if there are multiple boats going off in pairs, when they need at least 4 boat widths.

The creek is also used at all states of tide by the 6 metre wide Wind Farm service boats, which have a dock in the middle of Morgan's two pontoons. If a sailing vessel running downwind encounters one of these boats in that area at less than 1/2 tide they will have nowhere to go, other than to either run aground on Cindery Island or ram into boats moored on the pontoons if they cannot manage to stop otherwise. The whole thing is an accident waiting to happen, which is why the pilots of the commercial ships using Oliver's Wharf are so concerned about it. Colne Marina plan branded "dangerous" by ship pilots

Harriet Blanche is the smack aground on Cindery having tried to tack through this area at 1.5 hours after low water on Monday - without the pontoons she would just about have enough water to do so. - see photo in this news article . Petition against Morgan Marine development handed in to Brightlingsea Harbour Commissioners

The proposal, as it stands, presents a serious safety issue - perhaps 80 tons of engineless Thames barge swinging sideways under tow and clobbering a nice big catamaran as it passes through on its way to or from St Osyth Boatyard, or a ship being turned on the corner of the wharf dropping its spring line and side swiping a bunch of yachts on the nearby pontoon when the proposed protective dolphin becomes the pivot point for the commercial vessel.

That, dear "Tomahawk," is why so many people are against the proposal as submitted to the planning authority; but very few of us would object to an amended proposal that does not extend out beyond mean low water mark .

The solution, of course, is simple but much more costly than just chucking a couple of pontoons in the middle of the fairway. If Morgan's were to dredge out their two mud basins, as suggested further up this thread - and which was the original intention on the draft discussion document that Ollie Miller presented to the Harbour Stakeholder's meeting a couple of years back - then a significant number of their already existing pontoons would become accessible at less than high tides and they would then find it much easier to find customers willing to pay for berths on those pontoons; whereas many of these berths remain empty because some people actually want to use their boats other than at high tide........ just like me, and all the other mooring holders, at Underwood's Hard with our "cheap boats". I would be happy to support the proposal on that basis.
 
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johnalison

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A very interesting summary and I note that you have declared your interest. I am just left wondering what a Mevagissey tosher is doing over three hundred miles away from St Austell Bay. They are wonderful craft and yours must be a delight. We had many happy days out fishing for mackerel with 'Ambrose', and the rougher the better.
 

Kukri

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High water full and change. Time of High water, full moon and new moon. I E the time of high water spring tides.

Armed with this, you can make an educated guess at what the tide will be doing at a given date and time, if you don’t have a Tide Table. It used to be called “The Establishment of The Port”,just to confuse 18th century non-mariners.
 

Tomahawk

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Old Dozer,
If I may enquire, how do you get to your mooring an hour after after LW? I ask because looking at Google satalite images there is a lot of mud around the small pontoon with the tenders. That incidentally was taken about HW-2 or about 2.0 tide height. Yesterday I confirmed the pontoon is unusable at 15:00 or HW -3.5.

Then there is the small matter of actually getting Edme across the Folley at low water. If you are honest to people, you will acknowledge that you cannot navigate to or from St Osyth until there is sufficient water to cross The Folley at which point the fairway at Morgans East Basin has widened very considerably from the tima at which when you made your film . I suggest you wasted the opportunity afforded by the harbour. If you carried out your exercise when you could navigate The Folley, you would have had some actual evidence to present.
 

Tomahawk

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This started as a thread about change and decay. Some images of change and decay

Underwoods
IvTVC01.jpg


Morgans.. they took delivery of half a dozen of these last month to move customers boats about
99ZwDqM.jpeg




Underwoods
Ly8HgiZ.jpeg


Morgans, As happens, I am not a fan of spsort fishing boats but clearly it is pretty much brand new and being prepared for a new owner.
VVYfNqL.jpeg


Underwoods
J91drDH.jpeg

Which offers a vision of a prosperous future creating jobs and opportunity?
 

Capt Popeye

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This started as a thread about change and decay. Some images of change and decay

Underwoods
IvTVC01.jpg


Morgans.. they took delivery of half a dozen of these last month to move customers boats about
99ZwDqM.jpeg




Underwoods
Ly8HgiZ.jpeg


Morgans, As happens, I am not a fan of spsort fishing boats but clearly it is pretty much brand new and being prepared for a new owner.
VVYfNqL.jpeg


Underwoods
J91drDH.jpeg

Which offers a vision of a prosperous future creating jobs and opportunity?

Non of the above relate to a company the taking away (grabbing) an expanse of water thats has Public Right Of Way , ?
 

johnalison

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Decay is good. It is part of life's process and will always be with us. For as long as I can remember, visions of the future have always shown immaculate and uniform cities and environments with not a brick or stone out of place. This may have been the case for a while in places such as 19thC Paris, or Brasilia, but it is never going to be general. From the times of the Romans to today, cities, villages and ports have always been a mixture of old and new, with buildings going up to replace those that have crumbled. If nothing else, it allows us to see change happening, and even works as a memento mori.
 

AntarcticPilot

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Decay is good. It is part of life's process and will always be with us. For as long as I can remember, visions of the future have always shown immaculate and uniform cities and environments with not a brick or stone out of place. This may have been the case for a while in places such as 19thC Paris, or Brasilia, but it is never going to be general. From the times of the Romans to today, cities, villages and ports have always been a mixture of old and new, with buildings going up to replace those that have crumbled. If nothing else, it allows us to see change happening, and even works as a memento mori.
The deadest city I've ever been in was East Berlin. Almost totally redeveloped by the communist regime; modern buildings and streets, but as dead as a doornail. No traffic, no people - nothing.

Halls, my local boatyard, resembles the photos Tomahawk presents as "bad". But Halls does high quality work at reasonable prices. I don't care that the buildings etc. look a bit ramshackle - it's results that count
 
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