nicho
Well-known member
Absolutely correct. I have just, with a screwdriver, successfully tightened a union on a sink to stop it leaking.
Bow thruster for Beneteau Oceanis 323 Clipper
- Thread starter RogS
- Start date
lustyd
Well-known member
Some things like cars are less complex, sure. That doesn't mean I'm dumbed down it means I have time to achieve more in life than making rags dirty. If youy don't choose to use the extra time to better yourself that says nothing about society in general. In my lifetime I've seen society become ever more rich and complex.
Concerto
Well-known member
As an early poster in this thread, I replied on the basis of very limited information from RogS, the original poster. Many people seem to agree that training is a wise move. Now the non-traditionalists are saying fit one they are essential to park (yes, I mean park) their modern yachts that sit on the water rather than in it, have high freeboard that catches cross winds, are difficult to handle due to sail drives that are too close to the centre of effort and twin rudders do not get prop wash. Ah, the joys of having such yachts designed round the interior. The design of modern yachts does not make them that easy to handle, especially as most new yachts are getting larger and few builders making cruising yachts under 30ft.
In most marinas the number of heads that look out when a bow thruster is used near their boat, just checking it is not close to their yacht. It seems many other owners know the sound of a bow thruster means a yacht is not in the right position to get in to a berth. The sound is a warning to be wary and possibly have to fend off a yacht that may damage your own yacht.
If RogS still wants to fit a bow thruster, well that is his choice and accept the dent in his wallet. My advice is still to get some training before fitting a bow thruster.
In most marinas the number of heads that look out when a bow thruster is used near their boat, just checking it is not close to their yacht. It seems many other owners know the sound of a bow thruster means a yacht is not in the right position to get in to a berth. The sound is a warning to be wary and possibly have to fend off a yacht that may damage your own yacht.
If RogS still wants to fit a bow thruster, well that is his choice and accept the dent in his wallet. My advice is still to get some training before fitting a bow thruster.
pvb
Well-known member
Did you read post 57?
lustyd
Well-known member
If you want to use skill and a moldy damp old yacht that's your call. I'm more than happy for you to mutter as I bring my yacht into my berth. You're also welcome on board for a cold beer/wine/gin from the ample fridge, and sit in the comfortable cockpit to drink it. Yachting doesn't have to be a trial of wits, it's fine to enjoy yourself and it's fine to use modern things to achieve it. My car may be harder to maintain, but it does 90mpg on the motorway. My boat may be hard to singlehand in close quarters but it's spacious and comfortable to sail. All trade offs I'm willing to make.
lustyd
Well-known member
Too busy practicing their parking to engage in the conversation. Also probably reading on a 1998 Nokia screen because it was the pinnacle of phone technology...these kits with their large screens and simple interfaces...
Sandy
Well-known member
Line ten boats up and the value of them soon mounts up, there are often 20 in the marina. I know it is rude to talk about price with product like this, but I suggest your figures are rather on the low side, depending on choice of engine.
Clearly some people like them, but they are not to my taste.
lustyd
Well-known member
Well my figures came from a brokerage. With all due respect you seem to have pulled yours from your arse.
Concerto
Well-known member
Certainly did. As usual we have different opinions about the design of modern yachts compared to older designs. I am not alone, but when you talk to an experienced yacht designer as I did with Ed Dubois before his death and hear designs are centred on accomodation rather than sailing ability.
My comments in post #63 are still vaild and are a comment on the progression of yacht design. Maybe we should be expecting all modern yachts to come fitted with bow and stern thrusters as standard as you suggested. May I suggest they should be fully rotational for full control of a yacht during berthing like modern cruise liners (so they do not need tugs during berthing). Perhaps an electronic company will make these computer controlled so thay can be berthed automatically. That would be real progress and avoid the need to learn how to handle a yacht in to a berth, just like some cars have fitted.
pvb
Well-known member
The Volvo Penta IPS system is already moving in that direction.
CAPTAIN FANTASTIC
Well-known member
Bow thrusters are the way forward and they will be fitted in most boats in the near future as standard, perhaps electric winches will be a standard item too. My intention is to fit a bow thruster to make marina mooring and exit from tight space much easier. Its good to utilise technologies, progression and new experiences. So, go ahead and fit a bow thruster and please keeps us informed and send us some pictures of the installation.
ashtead
Well-known member
Yes or the OP could just buy a Hanse or suchlike with a drop down thruster fitted along with the self tacker and electric winches . All 3 make sailing a pleasure to be enjoyed for more years for many even on a larger vessel than the OP has currently. Just avoid if you can the risks of in mast reefing .
greeny
Well-known member
Does no one read the threads anymore before making suggestions? Fitting a conventional or even a retractable bowthruster is not going to be easy on a 323. See the photos and read about the water tank location.
ashtead
Well-known member
Hence my view Greeny to trade in for something else if a bowthruster thought to be useful
tyce
Well-known member
There was a thread running on here recently about the same thing. I have the Benny343 with twin rudders so understand your desire for easier maneuvering, I built a lift up stern thruster made up from the Side Shift Thruster base, drop it in the water when i need it and pop it back out when i don't, very powerful and zero drag and cheaper than the tunnel equivalent. It stows away on the sugar scoop nice and neatly and is poised ready for action taking about 5 seconds to lower it, maybe a little unorthodox but i like it. And should i ever so desire to sell my boat (unlikely) i can take it off and pop it on another, only has a couple of 8mm dia holes to patch.
Another chap built something similar but from bare components and was cheaper and looked very neat also.
I went the way i did because of the minimal forefoot available to fit a tunnel and i did not want the hassle of fitting or the drag from a tunnel, but there are a few 343's with tunnels but with mixed success, i think you need to keep the bow water tank full for it to work at its best.
Another chap built something similar but from bare components and was cheaper and looked very neat also.
I went the way i did because of the minimal forefoot available to fit a tunnel and i did not want the hassle of fitting or the drag from a tunnel, but there are a few 343's with tunnels but with mixed success, i think you need to keep the bow water tank full for it to work at its best.
langstonelayabout
Well-known member
1 - I'm one of the many people who have sailed a 323 from the Sailing Holidays fleet in differing locations around Greece. They are all fin keel and single rudder and we never found ourselves in a position where we needed a bow thruster to get us into a berth. Strong side wind? Make sure you have plenty of water flowing over your keel and rudder and position yourself to end up where you wish to be. It is all about planning and control.
2 - Bow thruster. We were put off buying a lovely 30' boat here in the UK because it was fitted with a bow thruster. They might have a rightful place in some boats (We've been on P&O and Cunard ships where they are useful) but not a 30'-ish boat. Also a mate with a 50' motor curiser has a hilarious story to tell that includes paying thousands of £ to a boatyad to have his hardly-used bow thruster fixed.
Good luck. If I were you I'd get to know your boat's slow speed handling characteristics a bit more.
2 - Bow thruster. We were put off buying a lovely 30' boat here in the UK because it was fitted with a bow thruster. They might have a rightful place in some boats (We've been on P&O and Cunard ships where they are useful) but not a 30'-ish boat. Also a mate with a 50' motor curiser has a hilarious story to tell that includes paying thousands of £ to a boatyad to have his hardly-used bow thruster fixed.
Good luck. If I were you I'd get to know your boat's slow speed handling characteristics a bit more.
xyachtdave
Well-known member
Hey OP, alternative view here!
If fitting a bow thruster is going to add to the enjoyment of your boat and take the stress out of parking, get it done if you can make it work practically.
I've read that people have suggested having own boat training, or if you're really lucky witnessing their 'berthing masterclass', or maybe trying complicated techniques that work on their boat for them but possibly not for you or anyone else...frankly I'm surprised nobody has suggested the YBW classic of buying a dinghy, because that apparently solves everything!
Your seaworthiness isn't always eroded by buying a bit of tech to help you out.
If fitting a bow thruster is going to add to the enjoyment of your boat and take the stress out of parking, get it done if you can make it work practically.
I've read that people have suggested having own boat training, or if you're really lucky witnessing their 'berthing masterclass', or maybe trying complicated techniques that work on their boat for them but possibly not for you or anyone else...frankly I'm surprised nobody has suggested the YBW classic of buying a dinghy, because that apparently solves everything!
Your seaworthiness isn't always eroded by buying a bit of tech to help you out.
tonywardle
New member
This is a very similar scenario to my new marina berth. I have had difficulty mooring up on every occasion but one (in the 2 months I have been able to use the boat between lockdowns). I'm going to try two different strategies and see which is more useful.
In the past I have run fore and aft lines to the centre as usual. But also rigged a spring line from the centre fairlead to the genoa sheet winch it makes it readily available to the helm. As we enter the berth, my crew at midships will slip the bowline over the end cleat, using a boathook, and the helm will tighten the spring and snug the boat up to the pontoon. I di this when singleahnded and more space is normaly available from the helm position. Keeping the engine in forward will keep the boat against the pontoon whilst tieing on.
Second strategy I'm going to try is to place an pontoon fender at the end of the berth and slowly drive onto it, putting the helm to pin the boat to the pontoon.
If these dont work I'm going to hire a marina manouevering expert to come and teach me for a day - haha
Beneteau Oceanis 323 Clipper "Elizium"
Based: Hythe Marina Village, Southampton, UK
lustyd
Well-known member
I did exactly this in December at Port Solent with Joe from Nomad. The day was well worth the money even if the conclusion was mostly that I had a crappy berth. Like yours, it was a closed berth so the theory goes that you reverse past it then drive into an open berth the opposite way, except I was next to a wall!
Joe really helped with my confidence and it gave a good chance to practice over and over in the new boat. I'd recommend a day if you're not happy, it wasn't as expensive as you'd think and the day is all about what you want to learn and practice. I'll be having another day soon but out on the water to practice some MOB drills with SWMBO
ashtead
Well-known member
I don’t know how well a 323 backs up as I only really have experience on a Bav which in my experience with the 2000 or so versions go better backwards than forwards but have you considered reversing into what is a non tidal berth in a locked marina ?
