Apologies in advance for an anchor thread

bitbaltic

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I’m planning on making some longer and probably single handed trips with Karisma in 2021. She is a 30ft Hanse 301 with a 3 tonne displacement. I know that fully loaded for cruising she tips the hoist scales at 4 tonnes (that’s full tanks and all gear needed onboard).

In her previous cruising life we have anchored very little but I see this changing. Back in the day when I bought her (2011-12) I fitted her out with two anchors: a 6kg delta and a 12 (I think; maybe more) Kobra 2.

we have only ever used the delta, only ever for lunch stops in maybe a F4 and have never had any setting or holding problems. It was bought specifically because it was the biggest (ie, best holding power according to the manufacturer) anchor that could fit in the locker alongside (from memory) 30m chain and 40m rope.

I have never used the Kobra 2. It was bought because it was at a great price from a chandlery in Bristol that was closing down. I have my doubts about how easy it would be to recover as it is twice the weight of the Lewmar. There is no windlass.

One of the reasons for buying the delta was Lewmar quote it as suitable for a 9m boat. I’ve done a review of anchors on F4 website and Lewmar still say this. However, almost no other manufacturer seems to regard so light an anchor as good for a 30 footer.

I want something I can be confident in overnight but still manually recover even if I can’t fit it into the locker, in reasonable cruising weather (4-5)

should I trust (limited) experience and Lewmar’s specs or should I look for a new best bower? I am sure the Kobra will hold in very poor weather and will keep it for when needed.

I guess I’m looking for experience of the lightest/smallest anchor you’ve used in the strongest winds on an equivalent length/displacement boat and specifically deltas in that situation.

thanks in advance and apologies if this runs to a hundred pages...

edited to add, the cruise will be from Milford Haven either a) around lands end to the south coast, b) to the eastern coast of Ireland (about which I know nothing much) or c) a more exposed route up the west coast of Wales but which attracts me more because I know the little stop-off and anchor points well from land.
 
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James_Calvert

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Not a direct answer to your question but we have a 12 kg Kobra 2 for our Sadler 32.

I don't find the weight a problem, but on our boat, anchors are stowed in their locker, not left on the bow roller and it can be a bit tricky getting the Kobra off, that's all. Largely due to the shape of it, it has a longer fluke than the 35lb sowester plough that it replaced.

Anchoring with 8mm chain and no windlass, weighing anchor at high water is a lot harder than at low, but that's the result of the extra chain, not the anchor.
 

bitbaltic

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Not a direct answer to your question but we have a 12 kg Kobra 2 for our Sadler 32.

I don't find the weight a problem, but on our boat, anchors are stowed in their locker, not left on the bow roller and it can be a bit tricky getting the Kobra off, that's all. Largely due to the shape of it, it has a longer fluke than the 35lb sowester plough that it replaced.

Anchoring with 8mm chain and no windlass, weighing anchor at high water is a lot harder than at low, but that's the result of the extra chain, not the anchor.
that’s an almost unreasonably reasonable reply, straight from the off, for a YBW anchor thread. Cheers :)
 

James_Calvert

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You're easily pleased.

As a direct answer to your question I tried our dinghy anchor once, a 2lb thames pattern.

It didn't work!
 

alahol2

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For the best part of the last 30 years we used a 10Kg Delta with 8mm chain on a variety of boats (26ft Tri, 32ft cat , 28ft mono). I can't ever remember having difficulty recovering the tackle and it never really gave us any cause for concern regarding holding. I'm not sure I would lie to a 6Kg delta with quite the same unconcern. I'd go for the Kobra as main anchor.
We've only changed to a "new gen" anchor recently because it happened along at a very low price and my Delta was starting to rust through.
 

BabaYaga

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Being singlehanded and without a windlass in a boat of similar size, in my experience, the most demanding part of retrieving anchor is not lifting the tackle off the seabed, but what precedes: Hauling the boat up to the right spot against strong winds and waves.
So regardless of which anchor you choose for bow anchor, try and arrange for some way that will let you quickly and easily lock and release the chain on the bow roller or on a separate fitting. Being able to catch your breath will make a big difference. Also very useful for breaking out the anchor.
 

duncan99210

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I feel that the Delta is way too small to be thought of as anything other than a lunch hook. The Kobra is of the same generation albeit but heavy for the boat. If I were outfitting the OPs boat I’d go for a new generation anchor in the 10kg range which I’d make sure will fit on the bow roller. Never really understood why folks persist in trying to store unwieldy, gel coat dinging lumps of galvanised steel anywhere other than ready to drop in a hurry if needed. I’d also review the spilt between rope and chain, looking to have say 10-15m of chain and the remainder rope as that‘d make recovery much easier than hauling 30mm of chain plus a heavier anchor.
Sits back, gets the Admiral to make some popcorn. I do enjoy an anchor thread.
 

Channel Sailor

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Strangely I have had an almost identical experience as alahol2, with the same anchor and used it it on very similar yachts Which I have taken with me as I changed yachts. Also I would offer the same advise reference a 6kg delta on a 30ft Hanse that it is too light for sleeping on. I briefly used a 6kg delta on a slightly smaller yacht but well loaded, on mud and it dragged one night on a change of tide. The next day I put the 10 (or is it 12kgs) delta on as a bower, and as usual I have always slept very well on it.

refer other anchor threads as to the merits or otherwise of delta, Kobra, and the rest of them.
 

simonfraser

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have a good nights sleep on a decent modern anchor of sufficient 'weight' and spent a bit more time in the morning hauling it back up again
weather is unpredictable, you don't want to be dancing around on the deck sorting the mess at 3am
 

johnalison

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Many of us use an anchor that is oversized according to the tables. I use a 45lb CQR on a five-ton boat and a friend used to have a 35lb one on their Sadler 32, with no windlass but a strong wife. Anchors will generally break out easily if pulled up tight and left for a minute or two, if you are concerned about the effort. A small lunch anchor is useful, but not the recipe for a relaxing night.
 

bitbaltic

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I feel that the Delta is way too small to be thought of as anything other than a lunch hook. The Kobra is of the same generation albeit but heavy for the boat. If I were outfitting the OPs boat I’d go for a new generation anchor in the 10kg range which I’d make sure will fit on the bow roller. Never really understood why folks persist in trying to store unwieldy, gel coat dinging lumps of galvanised steel anywhere other than ready to drop in a hurry if needed. I’d also review the spilt between rope and chain, looking to have say 10-15m of chain and the remainder rope as that‘d make recovery much easier than hauling 30mm of chain plus a heavier anchor.
Sits back, gets the Admiral to make some popcorn. I do enjoy an anchor thread.
this dovetails with my thoughts. Except that:

the foredeck on a 301 is to small to realistically keep a good anchor on the roller. The whole foredeck is occupied by the locker hatch, small as it is, and there are really no good places for fixings through the deck. I don’t know of any 301s which seriously stow their anchor on deck

the chain/rode choice was made many years ago for the inner Bristol Channel and is an ?octoplait custom make up by Jimmy Green. It might be different for cruising further afield but is what it is for the original cruising grounds.
 

Channel Sailor

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I had assumed for a boat of that type, size and proposed cruising distances that the OP would keep the anchor in the locker, not on the roller. It would only go on the roller on approach to an anchorage.

But if the locker is too small for the chosen anchor then it could maybe be stowed on deck on chocks just aft of the anchor locker. Which I have done myself on a small but heavy 3.5t yacht. But it does need very careful planning with choice of anchor and it’s exact positioning. No good if you have a deck sweeper genoa either.

Or modify the anchor locker to make it slightly larger in a specific area to suit your anchor. The aft wall of the locker is probably just plywood with a layer of GRP over the top.
 

James_Calvert

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So should the question really be what is the largest anchor that will fit easily into its locker, and is this big enough?

The reason I originally went for a sowester plough rather than a real CQR, the best anchor around of the day, was that a CQR was too long to fit in the size I wanted.

Re the Kobra 2, if you use that, I think you should keep it assembled, I wouldn't want to be fiddling about on the foredeck with a nut and bolt in an anchoring routine. But watch out for that fluke, it can catch on things. When we got ours I tried pulling it up whilst laid up ashore so I knew how it might behave.
 
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I trusted our Delta which came with the boat for years until one time in Osborne Bay when it refused to set and dragged. After umpteen attempts I hauled it in to find a large rounded rock wedged between the fluke and shank. I guess that sort of bad luck could happen with other designs but it struck me that the near parallel, slightly converging angle of the two parts had led to the rock jamming rather than just falling out. I replaced the Delta with a Spade.
 

doug748

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I’m planning on making some longer and probably single handed trips with Karisma in 2021. She is a 30ft Hanse 301 with a 3 tonne displacement. I know that fully loaded for cruising she tips the hoist scales at 4 tonnes (that’s full tanks and all gear needed onboard).

In her previous cruising life we have anchored very little but I see this changing. Back in the day when I bought her (2011-12) I fitted her out with two anchors: a 6kg delta and a 12 (I think; maybe more) Kobra 2.
.......................

I would use the Kobra and place the Delta on furlough. I'm an old geezer but pull up a 10kg anchor on 8mm chain, without too much trouble.

The only times when you will have to puff a bit are in places like the Channel Isles where you might anchor in 10m at low water and end up leaving at HW with 25m of chain right up and down.
With a bit of foresight you can avoid these situations.

.
 

wully1

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Get a bow roller extension that will let you fit a decent anchor.Then fit a windlass.
A remote control will be useful if you’re single handing.
Then get a Rocna or Spade. With as much cain as you can cope with.

If you are on your own and need to get the hook up in a tight spot with any kind of wind with no windlass it’s going to be challenging - no matter what your set up is.
 

James_Calvert

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I think I might get me some popcorn.

Essentially responses now lie between:

a. go for it with what you've got; and

b. don't do it without a load of extra expensive gear you don't have and which would need retrofitting at some expense and disruption.

I suggest you give a. a try locally and see how it goes.
 

bitbaltic

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dare I suggest a useful consensus around using the Kobra as an acceptable overnight hook on the understanding it will not be too difficult to handle manually.

I understand there is a risk the forum might implode on the suggestion of a anchor thread consensus....
 
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