Any issues for Liveaboards based in Spain

[AB1707]

Hi all,

My wife and I are full time liveaboards & currently wintering in Brittany. We plan to go to Galicia next season and stay there exploring the Rias for a couple of years. I’ve seen references to the Spanish matriculation tax and wondered if this was an issue that should affect our plans. Our boat is British registered and on the SSR. Or any other issues Liveaboards in Spain had come across?

Thanks in advance

Adam

 

[Tranona]

Hi all,

My wife and I are full time liveaboards & currently wintering in Brittany. We plan to go to Galicia next season and stay there exploring the Rias for a couple of years. I’ve seen references to the Spanish matriculation tax and wondered if this was an issue that should affect our plans. Our boat is British registered and on the SSR. Or any other issues Liveaboards in Spain had come across?

Thanks in advance

Adam

Nothing to worry about provided you do not intend applying for residency, which you are required to do if you intend staying more than 180 days a year in Spain. Even then the matriculation tax is minor. Note the 180 days applies to persons, not the boat. Good summary of the situation on the RYA site.

 

[Heckler]

Nothing to worry about provided you do not intend applying for residency, which you are required to do if you intend staying more than 180 days a year in Spain. Even then the matriculation tax is minor. Note the 180 days applies to persons, not the boat. Good summary of the situation on the RYA site.

IIRC the issue is staying beyond 183 days, they then class you as resident which then opens the can of worms that is spanish residents paying luxury tax on their boat and having to abide by spanish regs on your boat. Im sure that Stew will come back with more detail, he is more patient than me!
But I look at all the Spanish owned boats in Albufeira changing to Belgian reg a year or so ago to get around this.
Also bear in mind that what we thought was security on our pontoon in LL every couple of hours checking and clipboarding, the girl in the office confessed that she has to do a report every day on who is there. Their computers are v good at tracking you and unlike Portugal are nationwide.
Stu

 

[Tranona]

IIRC the issue is staying beyond 183 days, they then class you as resident which then opens the can of worms that is spanish residents paying luxury tax on their boat and having to abide by spanish regs on your boat. Im sure that Stew will come back with more detail, he is more patient than me!
But I look at all the Spanish owned boats in Albufeira changing to Belgian reg a year or so ago to get around this.
Also bear in mind that what we thought was security on our pontoon in LL every couple of hours checking and clipboarding, the girl in the office confessed that she has to do a report every day on who is there. Their computers are v good at tracking you and unlike Portugal are nationwide.
Stu

You are making it all too complicated and not reflecting the changes a few years ago. Yes, 183 days is the trigger point. So, if you want to take up residence there is matriculation tax to pay on your assets, but if you do it immediately there is a discount on the amount (which is based on a current value) so the actual amount payable is small. There is no need to put the boat on the Spanish register or to take any Spanish test.

If one is going down this road then there will likely be more issues than just a boat so legal advice in Spain is just about essential.

Although interesting for some, irrelevant for visitors passing through so long as they are aware of the time restriction. However, not sure there are rigorous checks to ensure the limit is observed.

 

[AB1707]

Thank you Tranona and Steve. I currently plan on being there over 183 days. I have now contacted a Spanish lawyer to advise me on applying for the exemption when I arrive in Spain. Has anyone else done this and what extra problems does it create.

 

[JFowler]

How would the Spanish know you’ve spent over 183 days in the country?
You are not required to clear in or out, so in theory no records exist. The calendar is reset on 1st Jan each year, so if you’re a cruising yachtsman you’re very unlikely to have a problem.

 

[lindsay]

If you come to the notice of the authorities they will simply ask you to prove you have NOT spend 183 days in their sunny country. Its your problem. Not theirs

 

[Carmel2]

How would the Spanish know you’ve spent over 183 days in the country?
You are not required to clear in or out, so in theory no records exist. The calendar is reset on 1st Jan each year, so if you’re a cruising yachtsman you’re very unlikely to have a problem.

ATM records, mobile phone bill.

 

[GrahamM376]

How would the Spanish know you’ve spent over 183 days in the country?
You are not required to clear in or out, so in theory no records exist. The calendar is reset on 1st Jan each year, so if you’re a cruising yachtsman you’re very unlikely to have a problem.

If you stay in marinas they pass your details to police, as do the Portuguese. Whether they bother to check up on people moving around I doubt but, if resident for well over 183 days in a marina, there could be problems.

 

[Heckler]

If you stay in marinas they pass your details to police, as do the Portuguese. Whether they bother to check up on people moving around I doubt but, if resident for well over 183 days in a marina, there could be problems.

As I said, the girl in our marina told me her first job every day is to send details of boats and peeps in the marina to the authorities.

 

[BoyBlue49]

If you intend to stay in one marina for more than the 183 days then you may come to the attention of the authorities but I suspect you intend to move around and maybe anchor to get the best from the rias. Portugal is not far for a weekend to break the counting days.
You will not regret your stay, how ever many days you are there.

 

[AndersG]

Thank you Tranona and Steve. I currently plan on being there over 183 days. I have now contacted a Spanish lawyer to advise me on applying for the exemption when I arrive in Spain. Has anyone else done this and what extra problems does it create.

That would probably tell them that you are staying more than 182 days and therefore are tax resident in Spain which means you are required to file a tax return and pay taxes according to what the spain - uk tax treaty says....
Quite a few years now since I've heard of any problems with matriculation tax and even then think all of them that had problem had been on a long term marina contract. Can't recall anyone that was caught when cruising.

 

[Garry & June 'Friendship']

I have never heard of anyone falling foul of this tax ( someone will no doubt be along to say otherwise)...and as for Marina's passing information to the authorities...well I know of at least one person, probably more, in our Marina who has been here 2 years and not travelled home at all...he even starred in a local Spanish news report about his liveaboard lifestyle...certainly not anything to worry about IMHO....

 

[AndersG]

Search the archives here and you will find people they were charging with this tax a few years ago.

 

[macd]

Another side of the same coin is looming. In just over a year from now, the 183-day rule may be irrelevant, since you could be limited to 90 days in any six months, anyway (and that's in the EU27 as a whole). The only way around this may be by becoming formally resident.

 

[Tranona]

Another side of the same coin is looming. In just over a year from now, the 183-day rule may be irrelevant, since you could be limited to 90 days in any six months, anyway (and that's in the EU27 as a whole). The only way around this may be by becoming formally resident.

Assume this is tongue in cheek as there is no indication that this will happen in march 2019 - if at all!

 

[jimbaerselman]

Adam,

The issues are dealt with fairly thoroughly at http://www.jimbsail.info/going-foreign/time-abroad. They arise from the interaction between two EU directives - one concerning people (tax residence), and one concerning any MoT (Means of Transport - cars, boats, planes, horses and carts) they bring into the country.

Tax residence in Spain is a people thing. It applies to those who spend more than 182 days in Spain during any tax year - which is (in Spain) is also a calendar year. You may also be a tax resident if you run a local business . . .

Boats are a customs thing. If you bring one in which is registered in another country, it may stay up to 180 days in the country without being "imported". Import, in this sense, means it will have to operate under all local regulations. Usually this means re-registering, but it's possible to maintain original registration, as long as you meet all local regulations (pay circulation taxes, carry equipment, meet seamanship regulations).

The pain hits if you're also tax resident. You then have 30 days from bringing in the boat in, or becoming tax resident, to go through all the formalities of import. If you don't, and you're caught out, you'll be charged a "pollution tax" - effectively a fine.

Avoid tax residency by arriving in July, departing in June the following year.

Avoid import by parking in Gibraltar, France or Morocco before 180 days are up.

Do it legal by getting advice from a "gestor" - a tax lawyer - and importing the boat properly.

 

[AndersG]

Another side of the same coin is looming. In just over a year from now, the 183-day rule may be irrelevant, since you could be limited to 90 days in any six months, anyway (and that's in the EU27 as a whole). The only way around this may be by becoming formally resident.

Did not expect this to be a problem until end of transition period Dec 2020. Have I missed something?

 

[macd]

Did not expect this to be a problem until end of transition period Dec 2020. Have I missed something?

I think you may have. The blessed Theresa's last pronouncement on the subject (last week, in China) was that EU nationals arriving in the UK after March 2019 could not expect to acquire residency by right. Reciprocity is the name of the game. (The EU27 is meanwhile insisting that all the 'four freedoms' must endure during any transition period.)

Of course none of this guarantees what will eventually be agreed, but if you're going to read the runes, best not miss any.

 

[GrahamM376]

A few EU countries have a lot of resident (but many not formally so) British ex pats and they won't want them to leave because of the income they generate but unfortunately the other states may overrule any deal to keep allowing free movement. We already have a situation where Spain enforces the residence rule whereas Portugal doesn't so it's anyone's guess what the future holds.