2 heads better than 1???

[Cosmo86]

Wow. What an incredible response. The vote is saying go for 2 put the arguments for 1 are pretty compelling. I need to set up a pros and cons list based on all your feedback. I started the day on 2, I’m leaning towards 1 but I can’t say I have made a decision.

 

[chrishscorp]

Carry a spare pump to swap in when the in-use one packs up. Then seal the non functioning one in a plastic bag and take it home to recondition,and then carry that as a spare. Saves the hassle of having to deal with a smelly mess at sea.

The one we had on board was some obscure make ( TMC ) so that would not have been possible, we now have a jabsco like just about everyone else....

 

[grumpy_o_g]

Wow. What an incredible response. The vote is saying go for 2 put the arguments for 1 are pretty compelling. I need to set up a pros and cons list based on all your feedback. I started the day on 2, I’m leaning towards 1 but I can’t say I have made a decision.

I voted two but that doesn't mean I wouldn't choose one if I was in your shoes. If I was doing a lot of blue-water cruising as opposed to staying near civilisation I'd want two heads but one would be storage/wet locker with a spare heads in it sealed up but ready to use if the other one failed.

 

[ashtead]

Many thoughts on here but in case not covered. a couple of thoughts based on our experience with a 12.8m boat from 2015. The installing of second heads might shorten the length of berth in forecabin? It would have on our boat. Looking at your plan adding the heads puts a hard wall at bed head . This might make it harder to clamber on board the bed if there are 2 of you . If an athletic couple with a toddler climbing in and out over a sleeping body alongside might not be an issue but for older users it can be an issue. In summary bed access is much simpler at night without the heads. Clearly not as good as wal around access favoured by larger vessels but better than a bulkhead . As others have said,more to go wrong in heads 2 but should you ever want to fit a water maker you have an existing hull hole through hull you might reuse . Ultimately it might depend on your sailing plans and if more crew likely and sailing destinations. We sail happily as a family four with one head though but longest passage so far would be less than say 15 hours or so . You might speak to a few brokers to see which is more in demand . Remember though 2 heads and showers might lead to more water consumption by crew so can you fit and extra water tank ? If you keep one heads you can still use the shower area for wet gear and just install an Eber heater with heads vent and buy a new dehumidifier which is good at also trying kit or hang the kit in the cockpit tent you can buy with the savings made from not having second heads. Lots to spend money on a new boat but have you been on a real version of each type of your proposed model? Sometimes pictures etc don’t convey the change if feel /ambience etc . I guess if you are planning sailing with strangers though a second heads might have attractions in terms of allocation of cleaning duties - a lot turns in this area on if it’s a family boat or one where you might regularly go away with third parties whom you know but not well for a few weeks holiday to say France etc.

 

[TiggerToo]

I am astounded by some of the comments here.

"Privacy"? On a sub 50 footer?

 

[geem]

The one we had on board was some obscure make ( TMC ) so that would not have been possible, we now have a jabsco like just about everyone else....

We have just ditched our two Jabsco loos. As liveaboards, heads get a lot of use. The Jabsco pumps are not robust. Parts are expensive.
We swapped to a Lavac. Our previous boat had Lavac and it was way more reliable than the Jabsco. Slightly different way to operate but no leaks, no stiff pump and no need to grease the pump shaft

 

[dansaskip]

What surprises me is the mention of having 2 heads so you can hang wet ollies in it. Whatever happened to wet lockers? To my mind it’s an indication of one of the things wrong with modern boat designs. My old fashioned boat has a wet locker, where it should be right by the companionway steps so you don’t trail wetness through the boat. Oh and just one head, less to go wrong and maintain.

 

[geem]

What surprises me is the mention of having 2 heads so you can hang wet ollies in it. Whatever happened to wet lockers? To my mind it’s an indication of one of the things wrong with modern boat designs. My old fashioned boat has a wet locker, where it should be right by the companionway steps so you don’t trail wetness through the boat. Oh and just one head, less to go wrong and maintain.

We hang wet gear in the engine room. We have walk in engine room with a hanging rail?
Unusual for a 44ft boat
We use one head as a shower room in the evening and the other as the head. It means we can leave the shower curtain out to dry overnight with the hatch open.

 

[Tranona]

What surprises me is the mention of having 2 heads so you can hang wet ollies in it. Whatever happened to wet lockers? To my mind it’s an indication of one of the things wrong with modern boat designs. My old fashioned boat has a wet locker, where it should be right by the companionway steps so you don’t trail wetness through the boat. Oh and just one head, less to go wrong and maintain.

The lack of dedicated wet lockers, like the declining fitment of chart tables reflect the way that buyers use their boats. If they were valued by new boat buyers, they would still be fitted. Nothing "wrong" with it just because it does not suit you, who I guess would never be in the market to buy a new boat!

Just to be clear, many modern boats have loo compartments next to the companionway (rather than forward through the saloon) so can easily perform the dual function of wet locker on passage. My boat (2015) has a dedicated wet locker in the loo/shower department. The boat the OP is buying also has a loo at the foot of the companionway and if he chooses the second loo he has the best of both worlds with a wet locker that serves as a loo in harbour and another loo for use on passage.

 

[cmedsailor]

You are buying a "pleasure boat" so spoil your self! When I was in the market for a new boat selling my old boat with only one heads I used to think that one is enough. I bought a boat that comes standard with two heads. One in the saloon area with enclosed shower compartment and another at the bow cabin. By selecting the version that suited my needs (number of cabins and configuration) the bow cabin includes additionally a separate shower. I just love it.

 

[Mudisox]

Surely it all depends upon what you intend to use the boat for?
We have a 32' catamaran with more space than a monohull. Two double berths aft and a seating saloon in the middle.
Bought to cruise with just us and an occasional other couple for 2 weeks max but also to act as a Committee Boat which has normally 6-10 folk onboard mostly female. Especially when also acting as standby accommodation running Match racing, for women.
The forward half of the starboard hull is a shower/ wash hand basin and lavatory. The pointy bit bit, housing hooks for outer garments along with spares and tools. The females enjoy the large space to reduce clothing, along with hot water to wash with. It also has a small opening window and a vent forward to keep it sweet.
The arrangement has performed well, [ with a large notice as to how to use].
Space is the key and it is a rare occasion that a second head has been needed.
Oddly enough and with fingers crossed, I have only had to sort a problem in 20+ years, when too much paper was used.

 

[dunedin]

I voted two but that doesn't mean I wouldn't choose one if I was in your shoes. If I was doing a lot of blue-water cruising as opposed to staying near civilisation I'd want two heads but one would be storage/wet locker with a spare heads in it sealed up but ready to use if the other one failed.

I remain staggered by the thought that you would want an entire heads (seacocks and all) “in case the other failed”. Not sure what you are doing with your heads, but must be doing something very wrong for this to be a big issue. And as swapping a Jabsco pump is one of the simplest of jobs (4 screws and 2 hose clips), anybody going blue water who cannot do that type of job at sea has bigger problems.
Why 2 heads can be important for blue water, is to have a heads on both sides of the boat. It can get annoying if heeled over for 2-3 weeks on the same tack, if the only heads is on the windward side, and struggling to suck in water.
But blue water and 3 weeks on the same tack does not sound like what the OP plans - nor indeed the vast majority of boat buyers.

 

[Moodysailor]

I remain staggered by the thought that you would want an entire heads (seacocks and all) “in case the other failed”. Not sure what you are doing with your heads, but must be doing something very wrong for this to be a big issue. And as swapping a Jabsco pump is one of the simplest of jobs (4 screws and 2 hose clips), anybody going blue water who cannot do that type of job at sea has bigger problems.
Why 2 heads can be important for blue water, is to have a heads on both sides of the boat. It can get annoying if heeled over for 2-3 weeks on the same tack, if the only heads is on the windward side, and struggling to suck in water.
But blue water and 3 weeks on the same tack does not sound like what the OP plans - nor indeed the vast majority of boat buyers.

I'd be less worried about a through-hull than having a heads fail. The former I've seen about twice in my 26+ years as a marine engineer, and the latter twice on my own boat in three years (you can find the reasons in my earlier post), and I've seen more times on other boats than I can remember it's predominantly operator error....

It may be technically correct to say swapping a Jabsco pump is simple, but the reality of a blocked/failed head usually means there is some troubleshooting to be done first, and usually a bowl full of something that has to be removed. Having done both of those jobs at sea in past, I know what option I personally choose now.... two heads are not reserved solely for blue water sailors, some of us choose them because we can, and want to.

Having redundant systems is not unusual on a boat, nor should it be undesirable. Given the choice and space, why not have redundant amenities too?

 

[Doineann]

We have 1 head on a 41 footer. The previous owner had Dehler convert the second into a small work room, which is really useful. But..
The only problem we have found is if you are in a marina for any period of time, say storm bound. With 2 heads, one could be designated for Number 2's into the tank, the other for pee only through the hull, that way you do not fill up the tank so quickly, and then find yourself trudging up to the communial loos at god knows what time

 

[coopec]

The number of heads was the subject of a thread a couple of years ago. The general consensus was for a yacht around 40ft two heads were the way to go.

I've decided to have a normal toilet system with a storage tank as well as a compost toilet in the aft cabin.

 

[Momac]

I know my chief officer would want the two heads version. We chartered a Bavaria 41 with a similar two heads layout which worked well for two couples.
But overall the front cabin looks cramped . Less saloon space and more bedroom space would be better .

 

[grumpy_o_g]

What surprises me is the mention of having 2 heads so you can hang wet ollies in it. Whatever happened to wet lockers? To my mind it’s an indication of one of the things wrong with modern boat designs. My old fashioned boat has a wet locker, where it should be right by the companionway steps so you don’t trail wetness through the boat. Oh and just one head, less to go wrong and maintain.

Look at it the other way round. You have a wet locker, a space designed to have enough height and space to hang oilies in in a manner that actually lets them dry out. Basically that's a reasonable size space that is built to handle water flying around and dripping on the floor, it ideally is warm to help things dry out. It's near the companionway as you want to shuck your wet gear as soon as you are below. Why on earth wouldn't you put a heads in there as well given that it has exactly the same requirements. The only issue is that you can't use the heads if it's full of foul weather gear so you need another heads which, as a bonus, gives you redundancy on the one piece of kit that no-one wants to fail.

 

[asteven221]

Layout 1 for me on that boat. Defo 2 heads. Our current boats has 2 - one electric and one manual. Works great , no practical disadvantages - only benefits..

 

[dune16]

We have 2 heads on our Dufour 430 and having come from a Jeanneau 389 with 1, with guests onboard, 2 heads is so much easier.

 

[Spirit (of Glenans)]

We have 1 head on a 41 footer. The previous owner had Dehler convert the second into a small work room, which is really useful. But..
The only problem we have found is if you are in a marina for any period of time, say storm bound. With 2 heads, one could be designated for Number 2's into the tank, the other for pee only through the hull, that way you do not fill up the tank so quickly, and then find yourself trudging up to the communial loos at god knows what time

Now that's a very practical consideration