Navionics vs C-Map for B&G Vulcan.

[KompetentKrew]

B&G seem to be trying to sell as many plotters as they can by the end of May, so I'm thinking to pick up a Vulcan, but I'm finding the chart options very confusing.

I didn't realise until yesterday that the Vulcan can also accept Navionics charts - B&G are giving away a free C-Map chart of the UK with purchases this month, so I started out looking at C-Map's offerings.

It seems to me that if I want to sail from Amsterdam¹ to the Spanish Rias I have to buy two overlapping C-Map "wide" charts, Y227² (Kiel to Biscay) and Y228³ (Ushant to Morocco, Canaries Azores). They're about £207 each.

These C-Map charts are available in MAX-N and MAX-N+ varieties. The difference is that Max-N+ has "easy routing" and aerial / satellite photos⁴ (only of selected harbours?) but it doesn't matter anyway because they're the same price or pretty close.

I spoke to a guy from MarineChandlery-dot-com today and he was very helpful, but I am surprised that C-Map sell "local" charts that are disproportionately expensive - they are half the price of the wide charts, but cover a fraction of the area (perhaps a tenth or even a twentieth). E.g. Y319 covers the Solent down to Falmouth⁵ and it's £125. Whereas you can get the whole of the UK for about twice that! Is the level of detail really the same?

(Honestly, I don't really doubt the helpful gentleman from MarineChandlery-dot-com, I am just amazed by this kind of pricing)

Moving onto Navionics, their Platinum+ has similar coverage to C-Map - Large Chart 25P+ covers South UK (inc Ushant and Channel France) to Hamburg⁶, and Large Chart 31P+ covers Iberia⁷ (inc French Biscay). The two overlap less than the two C-Map charts, and the Iberian one covers a bit of the Western Med, but they're broadly comparable in coverage; they're priced about 30% more.

However, in Navionics+ format, the large 46XG covers the whole of western Europe⁸ - Kiel to Ushant, the UK south coast, Biscay, Iberia, Canaries and Azores, Morocco, Algeria, Mediterranean France, Ibiza and Corsia. All in one chart for about £200.

Why is this half the price? Similar to C-Map's Max-N+, Navionics Platinum+ has fancy satellite overlay, 3D view and panoramic photos, presumably to help navigators orientate themselves visually. So the Navionics+ (not Platinum) is comparable to C-Map's Max-N - just the charts.

(Navionics also do "small" chart pricing strategy, covering 1/10th the area for 1/2 the price.)

Is there anything I've missed out?

Seems like the Navionics+ 46XG, the large one that covers the whole of western Europe (without the platinum features) is the best deal, and half the price of buying two C-Map Max-N or Max-N+ charts.

May I assume the basic cartography of both is just the same, or the detail equally as good?

Thanks in advance for any advice. I think I've arrived at the right conclusion, but would appreciate it if anyone can point out mistakes in my reasoning. Otherwise, hopefully someone else will find this comparison useful.



¹ I think the free offer C-Map UK chart covers a bit of Belgium but not the Netherlands
² https://www.marinechandlery.com/c-map-max-n-and-max-n-wide-chart-north-west-european-coasts
³ https://www.marinechandlery.com/c-map-max-n-and-max-n-wide-chart-west-european-coasts
⁴ http://lightmarine.c-map.com/gb/chart-plotters/c-map-max-n-2015
⁵ https://www.marinechandlery.com/c-map-max-n-and-max-n-local-charts-uk-40644
⁶ https://www.marinechandlery.com/navionics-platinum-chart-uk-south-hamburg
⁷ https://www.marinechandlery.com/navionics-platinum-chart-iberia
⁸ https://www.marinechandlery.com/navionics-chart-46xg-europe-west

 

[jwilson]

I replaced Navionics on a CF card in a dead Raymarine C70 with C-Map on a SD card in a B&G Vulcan 7. I slightly preferred the look of the Navionics charting, but not enough to spend £200 for another cartridge - the SD C-Map was free with the plotter at £499 a couple of years ago. The level of detail seems very similar.

 

[RIBW]

.... hopefully someone else will find this comparison useful......

I did. Thanks for raising this. Now that C-Map is owned by Navico and Navionics is owned by Garmin, I have been hesitant about renewing my chartplotter - a much appreciated SH300i with C-Map Max megawide charting, which includes every detail I could wish for. I also have Navionics on my C80 but rarely use it because I find the SH/C-Map more intuitive.

Your (and Marine Chandlery's) data helped me understand that if I wish to stick with C-Map, there are three main options:-

Max-N (where, from the compatability charts, N stands for Navico) - I would lose the Max Megawide version [which would have solved your Amsterdam to the Rias need]

4D MAX as used on Furuno and Raymarine. Seems to have the same coverage options as Max-N

MAX Megawide looks like it remains available for Matsutec and Onwa, plotters much covered in recent PBO postings.

Throw the NMEA 0183/2000 and display of Virtual A2Ns issues into the equation and I'll delay a decision until SIBS.

Personally, I would be concerned about using a Garmin product (Navionics) in a Navico device. It creates a possibility for 'finger pointing' between the two.

Much yet to understand!
Bob

 

[Piddy]

Slight thread drift here - sorry!

I have just inherited a Raymarine C120 and radome without charts. What are the options for Charts - I believe it will only use the older Navionics + charts. Can anyone confirm that before I go marching into a chandlery?

Thanks.

 

[KompetentKrew]

Compatibility tables: https://www.marinechandlery.com/electronics/electronic-charts/compatibility-tables

 

[pvb]

I spoke to a guy from MarineChandlery-dot-com today and he was very helpful, but I am surprised that C-Map sell "local" charts that are disproportionately expensive - they are half the price of the wide charts, but cover a fraction of the area (perhaps a tenth or even a twentieth). E.g. Y319 covers the Solent down to Falmouth⁵ and it's £125. Whereas you can get the whole of the UK for about twice that! Is the level of detail really the same?

The level of detail is different on the local charts, with more information, based on larger-scale charts. If you look at the C-Map website and go to the Coverage Area page, if you select any cartridge you can then click on the "Map List" button and you'll see a full list of all the charts on which it's based, together with their scales.

 

[AndyL]

¹ I think the free offer C-Map UK chart covers a bit of Belgium but not the Netherlands:
It is EW-N/Y226, which goes from the Kiel Canal to Roscoff. (including Belgium)


Whereas you can get the whole of the UK for about twice that! Is the level of detail really the same?
Yes, the detail is the same.

 

[KompetentKrew]

The level of detail is different on the local charts, with more information, based on larger-scale charts.

Are you sure this is true for their current range?

I don't mean to doubt you, and it's kind of what I expected, but I'm sure it's the opposite of what I was told by the fellow at MarineChandlery-dot-com.

If you look at the C-Map website and go to the Coverage Area page, if you select any cartridge you can then click on the "Map List" button and you'll see a full list of all the charts on which it's based, together with their scales.

Thanks. I'd not noticed that before.

This shows, for example, the wide chart EW-N227.43, North-West European Coasts as being based on 2430 charts (based on a copy and paste into a textfile and a simple line count), ranging in scale between 1:1000 and 1:90000. I don't immediately have time to compare it with examples from C-Maps' local range.

http://store.c-map.com/en?c=EW-N227

Do you have any recommendations, please? One must accept that charts are not cheap, but I was frustrated to think that a cruiser would buy a "wide" chart covering (for example) the whole of the south coast and Biscay, and then have to buy separate "local" charts for the Solent, Plymouth, the Channel Islands etc. Why even bother buying the wide chart if those local ones are necessary? It's different passage planning on a small scale paper chart.

 

[KompetentKrew]

¹ I think the free offer C-Map UK chart covers a bit of Belgium but not the Netherlands:

It is EW-N/Y226, which goes from the Kiel Canal to Roscoff. (including Belgium)

Thanks! The reason I was uncertain was because MarineSuperstore's publicity for the offer shows a slightly smaller area - I thought perhaps this must be a reduced-coverage chart they'd produced especially, so that the B&G offer would not cannibalise sales of other charts.

• https://www.marinesuperstore.com/gps-radar/fixed-gps-plotters/b-g-vulcan-7-chartplotter - https://archive.is/Trsey
• https://www.marinesuperstore.com/ma...onic-charts/cmap-uk-ireland-and-channel-max-n - https://archive.is/uQMPT

Whereas you can get the whole of the UK for about twice that! Is the level of detail really the same?

Yes, the detail is the same.

Great! Your help will save me some immediate financial outlay. :encouragement:

 

[AndyL]

The level of detail is different on the local charts, with more information, based on larger-scale charts.

I have not found that.
The Tyne piers 1:5000 on the UK&Ireland wide chart

The Tyne piers 1:5000 on the Bridlington to Montrose Local chart

 

[AndyL]

The level of detail is different on the local charts, with more information, based on larger-scale charts.

From the horse's mouth:

Hi Andy,

No they aren't. The detail is the same; only the wideness is different. Local charts are smaller than Wides

Best regards,
Laura
C-MAP Service Team

 

[pvb]

The reason I was uncertain was because MarineSuperstore's publicity for the offer shows a slightly smaller area - I thought perhaps this must be a reduced-coverage chart they'd produced especially, so that the B&G offer would not cannibalise sales of other charts.

They used the wrong image. That coverage area is the one for the C-Map MAX chart EW-M226.43 UK Ireland and the Channel. The MAX-N+ chart (EW-Y226.43) has a different coverage.

 

[RIBW]

..... The reason I was uncertain was because MarineSuperstore's publicity for the offer shows a slightly smaller area -.....

So does the Cactus offer:-
http://www.cactusnav.com/vulcan-inc...ooking-sonar-transducer-supplied-p-21937.html.

When I looked at this the other day, I assumed Cactus had used an illustration of the MAX chart version (M226), not the MAX-N version (N226). And, according to the compatibility charts, the MAX version won't work in the Navico products. Its an easy oversight for multi-product vendors to make although, luckily in this case, it looks as purchasers would get more than is advertised ?!?

Cheers
Bob
Ooops - crossed with pvb's

 

[pagoda]

We use a C-MAP mega wide micro SD card M-EN-Y-050 in our Vulcan 9. Works well
It is MAX N+
Northern France to Scandinavia/Baltic/to Svalbard and also Iceland.
No issues to speak of.

 

[KompetentKrew]

Replying here to keep the other thread for comparison of detail and this thread for coverage:

Going back to your original post, I believe that there is also s "Continental" scale C-Map chart that would cover Holland to Med on a single chart (although only south coast of UK).

Blimey! You're right! I wish I'd known about that before!

C-Map's Central and West Europe Continental, chart number EW-D060 or EW060, has the same coverage as Navionics' 46XG. The area is either very nearly the same or exactly the same - from the coverage maps below, I can't see any difference. They are about the same price too, £200 - £220.

I'm not sure which I prefer, but would probably have stuck with C-Map since I was familiar with it. I definitely prefer the way C-Map displays tidal information, but otherwise Navionics presentation is growing on me - it's perhaps less cluttered. Pics and discussion of that in the other thread.

Pics:

Navionics 46XG:​

Southbank Marine: Navionics 46XG Central & West Europe​

Seamark Nunn: Navionics Plus 46XG Pre-Loaded Chart XL9 Central and West Europe CF​

C-MAP Central and West Europe:​

SVB24.com: 4D MAX Central and West Europe EW060​

Marine Chandlery dot-com: C-Map Max-N Continental Charts​