what is the kicking strap for?

S

Shearwater

Well-Known Member
Joined
19 Oct 2005
Messages
428
Location
Felixstowe Suffolk UK
Visit site
I have a 4 to 1 kicking strap under my boom but must admit I have never used it - 'cos I don't really understand what it is for. Presumably when on a broad reach you tighten it up to stop the boom lifting but does this make so much difference? We're talking about a 24 ft trailer sailer here. tks n over..
 
The kicker is almost as important as the mainsheet. On a racing boat it's played all the time, suggest you get some reading or instruction.
 
Hello Guinevere. The kicking strap is important because it control sail shape. As you say, on a run it prevent the boom lifting - that helps stop the wind spilling out of the top of the sail. But it is just as important when sailing closer to the wind. Upwind a sail gets its efficiency from acting like an aerofoil in the same way as an aeroplane's wing. Like an aeroplane's wing, it's important that it has an efficient aerofoil section all the way up (with just a bit of twist). You can't easily achieve this with the mainsheet alone (which even if sheeted in when close hauled will tend to let the boom lift in gusts and therefore spoil the efficient sail shape), so you need the kicker.

Best to get more background info on sail shape etc. via a sailing school and/or a book or two on the subject, 'cos it's a big subject, and an important one for fun and efficient sailing.
 
Guinevere,

Ohers about here have suggested some reading - I would thoroughly recommend "Yachting Monthly's" Sailpower: Trim and Techniques for Cruising Sailors"

This link to Amazon might work:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Yachting-Monthly...TF8&s=books

I think is a blisteringly good and readable introduction to a black art. I've read it three times already and am now going back to it again.
 
Mant tks; shall put this advice to effect next week when she goes in after a scrub and new anti-foul.

Sorry to say it's been 30 degrees again today with a North F 3-4 in the morning and a South ditto in the p.m. after about 15.00 hrs but you didn't want toknow that did you ? /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif
 
/forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gifNo don't worry I much prefer the pouring with rain here all day it's very good for the crops you know and anyway if you have soap saves all that having to shower at home before going to bed /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif
 
I'm not sure how your rig actually responds since I haven't sailed one. However, if it's one of the no-backstay-swept-back-spreader types with a fairly flexible mast, then heaving on the kicker will also flatten the sail as well as help control the twist.

The kicker doesn't only pull the boom down. It pushes it forwards with possibly even more force than it pulls it down. This, combined with the pull on the leach has the effect of inducing mast bend. Since the luff is curved, it's pushed back and forms the belly of the sail when it's on a straight mast. Now bend the mast and you start to flatten the sail.

Therefore, it can be better to pull in the kicker going up wind.

Actually playing the kicker can be advantageous in gusty winds too. As long as the main sheet is not over riding the kicker down force, letting the kicker off will spill wind from the top of the sail in the gusts while keeping the lower part of the sail pulling.
 
I tend to disagree with many of the posters. If only in degrees of significance. ie Your trailler sailer almost certainly has a deck stepped mast with a kicker operating over a small distance from cabin top to boom so it can hardly induce any mast bend by pushing boom into mast. In fact if yours is like my TS there is just not enough room to have any real power in the kicker. If you move the attach point out on the boom you are pulling closer to the boom end but at a terrible angle for power.

It is also likely that your TS has a full width traveller for the mainsheet. This system has much more ability to pul the boom down and is in my opinion far more effective in controlling mainsail shape.
Such that only when the boom is allowed to swing out beyond the main sheet traveller is the kicking strap going to do any good.
So its main value on your boat could be only in stopping the boom from rising and instigating an unexpected gybe when running square to the wind.
So my TS 21 ft has been used for continuous racing for 21 years with a lot of local success. (20 first to finish last season) and no I don't even have a kicking strap. Yes I sometimes wish I had one when running but then when slightly off the wind under spin when a round up is likely you need to be able to dump all power from the main the kicking strap should be released completely as well as the main sheet so it is safer not to have a kicking strap. (or at least leave it very loose)

So there is a contradictory opinion. Obviously in contrast to many experts. But many boats are different so try it and come to your own conclusions but don't just slavishly pull on the kicking strap unless you are sure it is doing some good. olewill

PS re the weather. We had 27degrees max yesterday sunshine with gentle breeze, similar today until storm comes in. But then these are last days of winter for us.
 
Hi
I was taught that the kicking strap is there to prevent the boom kicking up during a gybe -hence the name. If the main sheet is fully out, and you don't have a strap, the boom can rise up so much you can get a horrible thing called a chinese gybe. The main goes all over the place and it can result in what is very like a broach. Never gybe without one.
 
Kicker is to control sail shape in all aspects of sail as others have said
Certainly didnt stop a chineese gybe with us - spinnaker up, mast goes on water, then let go the kicker & everything else - and find yourself aground !! Quite entertaining on a 38 footer!
 
I tend to agree with Olewill. A kicking strap is of limited use on a boat with a main sheet traveller when within the limits of the traveller. The combination of traveller and main sheet is a much more effective method of controlling mainsail twist when sailing upwind, because the mainsheet is usually much more powerful than the kicking strap. The kicking strap starts being useful when the traveller has reached the end of its travel, or on boats without a traveller that use vang sheeting instead.

Interestingly, the Dragonfly trimarans like my son's 920 don't have a kicking strap, and they have excellent upwind sailing performance. Twist upwind and on a reach is controlled by sheet/traveller. They don't really sail directly downwind, because the boom can't be pushed out far enough because of the backstays, and anyway, everywhere's upwind or a reach on a trimaran.
 
[ QUOTE ]
Kicker is to control sail shape in all aspects of sail as others have said
Certainly didnt stop a chineese gybe with us - spinnaker up, mast goes on water, then let go the kicker & everything else - and find yourself aground !! Quite entertaining on a 38 footer!

[/ QUOTE ]

Was that at Cowes week off the Green?
 
Do like 99.9% of other boaters do ...... tighten it up with boom in central position, topping lift holding boom at correct angle and sail not hoisted.

Leave it till next time mast is unstepped.

For those 99.9% of boats .... it is purely there to stop the boom rising when sailing downwind ...... all the other stuff you will read / hear is fancy stuff that really doesn't matter a hoot to majority of boats !!

Sorry to be blunt about it and of course some "expert" will shoot me down for the above !!

Blimey I've heard it all now ..... pulls the boom INTO mast and alters luff etc. Yeh - like to see 'em try and majority of boats - especially when you have a rod kicker set to assist mainsail furling !!!!
 
Hmmm, not sure that 99.9% of boaters do that.

To each his own approach of course, and I'm sure that many don't bother to adjust kickers or sheets etc. but for me one of the greatest pleasures is getting the boat sailing efficiently. A little tweak of a sheet or the kicking strap here or there, and the boat can take off. Really nice feeling. I like this sense that you can almost FEEL the airflow over the sail.

It always amazes me how many people you see on all points of sailing with the sails sheeted in hard, going nowhere very fast.

I reckon there's a difference here between people who gaduated from dinghies, where you can see and feel immediately the difference sail trim makes, and those who learned on keelboats, where you tell the difference mainly by looking at the log, or can just turn the engine on if the boats not sailing well. Also a difference between masthead rigs, which are relatively inflexible, and fractional rigged boats, where there's more scope for playing.

Also, if the sail's shaped like a sack of potatoes anyway, it's harder to get it working like an aerofoil...
 
I disagree in part ..... cause I grew up with dingy's as well as larger ....

I can tweak a kicker / sheet with most ... so appreciate the effort ... in fact I can go further than just cars and sheet horses / travellers etc. - barber haulers and adjustable blocks etc.

But here I suspect we are talking about cruising along with an average boat ... the guy is admittedly a newcomer to sailing and asks about the kicker .... I gave him a sensible answer that caters for majority time and is easy.

You mention adjusting sheets - no-one I know just bumbles along without adjusting sheets at some time or another !! Sheets have major effect on boats performance - far outweighing kickers .... in fact I would say that luff tension far outweighs kicker as well .....

I say agin that 99.9% .... even more I would hazard to say - need not play around with kickers ... sheets and luff are enough to sort ....

My race boat in tallinn had kicker led back to cockpit to be able to adjust in the heat of a race .... I can honestly say that it was the least touched line of all ! In fact I would say that the mooring lines were touched more !! and they had only cast off and back on again !!

/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
I have to agree with this view. If you have a mainsheet traveller then while the boom is within the arc of the traveller the kicking strap is pretty much redundant. I sailed a Dart catamaran which has no kicker or boom - and this work really well - but the traveller is the width of the boat.

The other point raised above is about the combined force of the kicker. In reality most kickers are at an angle of less that 45 degrees to the boom, and so consequently about 30% of the effort in the kicker is vertically downward and the rest is horizontally pushing the boom through the mast. On dinghies this is used to bend the mast in windier conditions and so reduce the draught in the lower sections of the mainsail. Indeed this is so powerful that many dingies have lower shrouds specifically to control the amount of bend that can be applied (useful if you don't want to break your mast).

However - on a yacht with a cruising bias this is not going to happen. The kicker is unlikely to be powerful enough, and the mast too stiff. Pulling the draught out of the main is more readily achieved with either the cunningham (which will try to bend the mast anyway - but over the whole length rather than just at the bottom), or the back stay (if you have a fractional rig rather than a masthead rig).

So we come back to the point where the kickers main role on an "average" boat is to stop the boom lifting once it falls outside the arc of the mainsheet traveller. Consequently it doesn actually need to be that powerful.

This is my opinion, but works for me on my boat.

Regards,
Jeff.
 
I agree with what others have said and maybe what you're indirectly implying that kickers have their limitations upwind in that at least the function is partly covered by the mainsheet's horse and traveller. But the kicker is still one of the fundamental sail controls, and I think that being familiar with its use (I'm not trying to imply that you're not familiar with it), is a pretty basic part of the art of actually sailing.

About use of the kicker upwind. It's true to a certain extent that the mainsheet + traveller can replace it. But even using the traveller the kicker is useful because if you just use the mainsheet + traveller the boom will be pulled down by mainsheet tension when the wind gets lighter in between puffs, closing the leech of the sail, giving a flat sail shape with closed leach, just what you don't want in light airs. It's better to use the kicker to get the optimum boom height, ease out the mainsheet a bit, then use the traveller to pull the sail to the right angle to the wind. It saves a lot of playing with the mainsheet. So the kickers still very useful even when beating.
 
Many thanks to all - you've given me much to think about and to experiment with. To answer some points, my Hunter Liberty 23.5 does not have a traveller nor a back stay (it is, after all, American!) and the kicking strap is quite modest - the string is as thick as a washing line - not an issue from breaking strain point of view but the putting enough welly into pulling it tight; perhaps a toggle like the old Seagull pull cord perhaps. Nyway tks to all - I've printed everything off and will answer some folk privately.
 
High Simon. With your fuller description of the boat set up you would benefit by using the kicking strap if you have no traveller system and no backstays. However you will need another purchase on the tail of the 4 purchase sustem to make it 8 purchase to be noticeable.

Interesting the comments about Chinese Gybe. We had a discussion a while back about what it means. The original meaning was of a specific situation where the boom gybes across but the top of the main remains on the other original tack. One enormous twist which is only possible if the booms lifts up. Easily7 stopped with a kicking strap or wide traveller.
NB the later meaning of chinese gybe which seems to have come into use is really just the boat overpowered especially under spin laid on its side and consequently turning into the wind to scare the hell out of every one. olewill
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page

Top