Portofino
Well-Known Member
Is it any good in other than mill pond conditions? Really need to see the deadrise - and looking at images seem s a good un - in that size range
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Power upgrade...how much is too much?
- Thread starter Greenheart
- Start date
Is it any good in other than mill pond conditions? Really need to see the deadrise - and looking at images seem s a good un - in that size range
TheOrs
Well-Known Member
BruceK
Well-Known Member
And also being biased don't forget Thunderbird Formulas, especially their Fas3tech range.
www.formulaboats.com
Plenty go fast boats in their range and if you want a bit of luxury too, their Pc's which have essentially remained unchanged since launched in the late 80s
https://www.boatingmag.com/boats/formula-34pc-surprise-party
http://www.boattest.com/oem/386/boats/3584/0/
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[2068]
...
So, this is "too much".
20ft boat, 1140hp, 107kts and no engine or belt covers:
20ft boat, 1140hp, 107kts and no engine or belt covers:
Portofino
Well-Known Member
They are really honest no nonsense “ blurbs “ ^^^ .
You don’t see that these days in boat brochures.
I like the ref ( PC ) about the hull mounds and the pic demonstrating “ look here no ripples folks “ or words to that effect .
I like the honesty of the real world cruise of 32 mph @ real world rpm of 3500 for the petrol .
Not just a headline grabbing 48 mph in there 1st .
Also I like the honesty of ——
“Dead-rise. The other most dramatic dichotomy in the general specs among the eight boats studied was the deadrise angle of the bottom at the transom. Here, four boats joined the 34 Performance Cruiser at the low end – 18 to 19-degrees, while the other four were 20-degrees or more. This says to us that the 34 Performance Cruiser's 18-degree deadrise is designed to maximized the boat's fuel-efficiency and speed, while providing a bit more buoyancy in the stern.”
It’s nice that a builder feels confident to say it as it is .
Lost count how many times @ boat shows when stud on a boat marketed as a “performance cruiser” I asked the rep - “ do you know the deadrise please “ and I got a gormless look back ,followed by a scuffle in the back of glossy. Brochure ,btw I have already read .
I think we need to perhaps think about splitting the discussion into two groups ,and remain focused .
1- out drive 80,90,s “ performance cruiser” like the XPS 35 and the Formula PC 35 - kinda below 9tons displacement
2- over 9 tons shaft drive inboard diesels say 38 to 70 odd feet - this where those Baia,s Otams , Itama ,Magnums sit
Coming back to group 1 , there’s those Don Shead long n thin performance orientate SunSeekers with names like
Apache, Tomohawk , Thunderhawk , - one or two could be specced with triple motor s abs out drives .
Well sure that’s a huge nod to the P in the “ performance cruiser “ side of the equation?
Then the Superhawk range , again triple options including Trimax surface drive as well .Narrow beamed boats 3.25 if I remember?
Then finally the Superhawk 43 , at beam of 3.6 ( ish ? ) - blending Lux n Performance, it too could be specced with surface drives - Arnesons , or triple out drives , again you could move the cursor along from P to C as you wished .
C or cruiser by adding Kg,s in the form of Aircon ,geny , etc
A deep V stepped hull to boot .
But and a big but the interior with the 3,6 beam and single open plan accommodation was too much of a compromise.
Like where do you store a tender ? How big is the bathing flatform for fun in the water ? Small fridge etc etc
At arround the 4 m mark beam wise the “cruiser “ bit starts to open up imho to the point where separate cabins , multlpe heads etc come into play .
Itama 38 is 3.8 M , Baia B 40 - 3.9M ,
Ok switching to shafts blunts the top end headline grabbing figure compared to outdrive boats ,but easing into 20+ deadrise territory ,inceases the real world use ability, all day cruise speed - cos of less slamming .
That bit extra beam of 50 to 70 cm from 3,25 / 3,5 ish to arround 4 means you can fit chunky 7 L diesels like CAT v8 ,s and move away from VP small block stuff like the XPS 35 .
It’s all a comprise in the end ,sounds compicated , but the whole PC ethos can be distilled down into two important components
Deadrise
Horse power
You need both numbers to be a high as you can buy :encouragement:
AIMHO
Boatbore
Well-Known Member
I think all the above wisdom demonstrates clearly that there is a trade off between comfort and speed.
I think you need to think about how fast you want to go..... if you didn’t like bouncing around on the rib then my guess is you want to go fast 30 to 40 knots, But not FAST 50 knots plus.
If it’s 45 knots plus that you want then it’s all about speed then you can look at the real speed machines : Cigarette, Donzi, Apache, or even the US multi hull brands like Nor Tech or Skater. Someone above also mentioned the Bladerunner. These are all out and out speed machines, with an interior that would allow some horizontal gymnastics and possibly a bathroom but I’m not sure anyone would be grateful for a week on board !
If you go up one notch on the comfort stakes you get to Hunton as a gentleman’s version of a go fast Boat. Their 37ft boat is brilliant and very fast..... you could just about stay a few nights on board too. Their larger model is the 43 which is much more comfy but a lot more Boat in terms of costs. If you want the older styles they also made smaller boats in the 1980’s called the Gazelle, which had enough room inside to be semi comfortable as well.
After that you are in the much more cruisable fast boats that Portofino talks about above : itama, magnum, otam, baia have been mentioned, but there is also Pershing. The all important dead rise and huge hp make these beamier boats ideal for mediterranean conditions, and you see a lot of them there. Not all of them are fast though - fuel consumption means many are specc’d with “sensible” engines and give a top speed only in the high 30’s
The posts above also mention the more common (in the uk at least) stable of fast but cruisable boats..... Sunseeker Tomahawk (37ft) is a fast boat from the 1980’s, built like a tank, with an interior that you could live on for a few days, it has a big brother called a Thunderhawk (43ft) and then in the 1990’s was upgraded to the Superhawk range, the smallest one being 34 ft and the largest at 50. A range of engines and drives was available and ther will be much opinion about which was best etc.
More recently sunseeker produced another Superhawk at 43ft but it was never very popular. If you can find a version with arneson surface drives you will get the higher top speed, but at a significantl6 higher cost of maintenance.
I am in the process of rebuilding a 2002 Superhawk 50, with triple 420hp Yanmar and surface drives she will be good for almost 50 knots. She also has a respectable interior and a separate sleeping cabin in the bow.
Finally the obvious brand that perhaps blends performance with comfort is Windy. These are brilliant sea boats, fast enough to make you wince, and comfy enough to cruise on
If you are constrained by budget and want something older, smaller and still very fast to rebuild. I would probably suggest messing about with an old sunseeker Superhawk 37, or an old hunton(if you can find one) ....... modern engines and interiors would make both marques very fast and still comfortable.
I think you need to think about how fast you want to go..... if you didn’t like bouncing around on the rib then my guess is you want to go fast 30 to 40 knots, But not FAST 50 knots plus.
If it’s 45 knots plus that you want then it’s all about speed then you can look at the real speed machines : Cigarette, Donzi, Apache, or even the US multi hull brands like Nor Tech or Skater. Someone above also mentioned the Bladerunner. These are all out and out speed machines, with an interior that would allow some horizontal gymnastics and possibly a bathroom but I’m not sure anyone would be grateful for a week on board !
If you go up one notch on the comfort stakes you get to Hunton as a gentleman’s version of a go fast Boat. Their 37ft boat is brilliant and very fast..... you could just about stay a few nights on board too. Their larger model is the 43 which is much more comfy but a lot more Boat in terms of costs. If you want the older styles they also made smaller boats in the 1980’s called the Gazelle, which had enough room inside to be semi comfortable as well.
After that you are in the much more cruisable fast boats that Portofino talks about above : itama, magnum, otam, baia have been mentioned, but there is also Pershing. The all important dead rise and huge hp make these beamier boats ideal for mediterranean conditions, and you see a lot of them there. Not all of them are fast though - fuel consumption means many are specc’d with “sensible” engines and give a top speed only in the high 30’s
The posts above also mention the more common (in the uk at least) stable of fast but cruisable boats..... Sunseeker Tomahawk (37ft) is a fast boat from the 1980’s, built like a tank, with an interior that you could live on for a few days, it has a big brother called a Thunderhawk (43ft) and then in the 1990’s was upgraded to the Superhawk range, the smallest one being 34 ft and the largest at 50. A range of engines and drives was available and ther will be much opinion about which was best etc.
More recently sunseeker produced another Superhawk at 43ft but it was never very popular. If you can find a version with arneson surface drives you will get the higher top speed, but at a significantl6 higher cost of maintenance.
I am in the process of rebuilding a 2002 Superhawk 50, with triple 420hp Yanmar and surface drives she will be good for almost 50 knots. She also has a respectable interior and a separate sleeping cabin in the bow.
Finally the obvious brand that perhaps blends performance with comfort is Windy. These are brilliant sea boats, fast enough to make you wince, and comfy enough to cruise on
If you are constrained by budget and want something older, smaller and still very fast to rebuild. I would probably suggest messing about with an old sunseeker Superhawk 37, or an old hunton(if you can find one) ....... modern engines and interiors would make both marques very fast and still comfortable.
Bigplumbs
Well-Known Member
I know this is a bit of thread but if speed is your thing and you want it affordable. Have 2 boats one to stay on and then a 17 footer with a 150 hp outboard on the back. You will not be disappointed
Dennis
Dennis
NBs
Well-Known Member
I think of the most interesting day cruiser manufacturer of Norwegian Hydrolift https://hydrolift.com/. Look at these two videos, another electric cover, like cars, and the other with a bit of general. They have several models of really fast boats, I do not know whether they are selling these UK.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8m4HaGGqehc
And
https://youtu.be/R988sXqzA2M
And hydrolift 24 feet take 87kn...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NB6cvbuh1II
NBs
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MapisM
Well-Known Member
Define "really fast". Some adrenaline junkies would think that any speed which only takes two digits to be measured ain't fast enough.
But one possible answer to your question is my old lake toy below: standard production, and capable of 62kts with stock Mercury 496HO (450hp or so).
I seatrialed in San Diego an identical boat, also standard production, with just the engine massaged by Raylar to get about 200 more ponies, and she was good for a dozen of kts more.
Both with stock Bravo 1XR outdrive.
Good fun, and the forward cabin still provided a decent accommodation for a couple!
Portofino
Well-Known Member
I would “define really fast “ in the context of this thread and picking out “ acceptable ride in waves “ in dancranes question
As fast enough to be able to move around the boat safely and carry out everyday cruising functions while running , without slamming or worrying about slamming or adjusting the throttle s or reading waves to prevent slamming .
Just as an anecdote
I came back to my home port from Antibes in F 6 in confused seas arround the cap on a day last season .
Me and a Superhawk 50 - yup a Trimax drive Vs .
He could only manage low twenties .
The waves were all over the place , how ever when we turned down wind as near as dam it as he attempted to speed up he just went up in the air bow first purposing up and down the waves which were 3 M +
Kept bobbing up the sky then almost stuffing the bow crashing down a slope into the next wave .
on paper on a lake , that boat can exceed 50 knots .
That day the driver was driving full on concentration low twenties .
I came up from behind and slid by at a steady eco cruise of 28 knots , in fact the faster I went the more I ironed out the waves .
He drop in behind in my wake - now a flater sea , but he could not keep up and receded into the distance .
So I think the subtle nuance here that nobody has touched upon is the weight distribution.
Our lumps cut the boat accommodation spaces in 1/2 ,because they are mounted in the middle .
Along with a deep V helps cut through waves and gives a flat comfortable ride .
Meanwhile the Superhawk has its lumps at the stern ,probably flatter mid sections ( hull designed for lift cos of out drive variants ) - this meant a predisposition to porpose in waves over 3/4 M as it rode on top and did a roller coaster effect as posed to smash through and level the ride .
As fast enough to be able to move around the boat safely and carry out everyday cruising functions while running , without slamming or worrying about slamming or adjusting the throttle s or reading waves to prevent slamming .
Just as an anecdote
I came back to my home port from Antibes in F 6 in confused seas arround the cap on a day last season .
Me and a Superhawk 50 - yup a Trimax drive Vs .
He could only manage low twenties .
The waves were all over the place , how ever when we turned down wind as near as dam it as he attempted to speed up he just went up in the air bow first purposing up and down the waves which were 3 M +
Kept bobbing up the sky then almost stuffing the bow crashing down a slope into the next wave .
on paper on a lake , that boat can exceed 50 knots .
That day the driver was driving full on concentration low twenties .
I came up from behind and slid by at a steady eco cruise of 28 knots , in fact the faster I went the more I ironed out the waves .
He drop in behind in my wake - now a flater sea , but he could not keep up and receded into the distance .
So I think the subtle nuance here that nobody has touched upon is the weight distribution.
Our lumps cut the boat accommodation spaces in 1/2 ,because they are mounted in the middle .
Along with a deep V helps cut through waves and gives a flat comfortable ride .
Meanwhile the Superhawk has its lumps at the stern ,probably flatter mid sections ( hull designed for lift cos of out drive variants ) - this meant a predisposition to porpose in waves over 3/4 M as it rode on top and did a roller coaster effect as posed to smash through and level the ride .
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Boatbore
Well-Known Member
Ouch.......I’ve got one of them sunseeker Superhawk thingummies and I keep it in SoF...... hope that wasn’t me you annihilated ! Lol !
In fairness I bought it in June and it was hopelessly unbalanced. Not only did it have a 100kg of passarelle mounted on the transom but it also had a 200kg 4kw genie mounted.......yup, right in the bathing platform and directly over the surface drives. I had to drive her with about 30% flaps just to get her to run flat.......and given the flaps are about 3 ft long, that is a lot of drag ! I think these boats were designed to handle the sea, She is basically one long thin V shape, but as you say if the weight is messed up then they just don’t go....... I will know more in the spring ! Fingers crossed.
Do I sound a bit defensive of my baby ?
She now has no passarelle, and the old generator has been replaced with a new Fischer panda 3.5 kw which weighs 80kg from memory. Hopefully (and I won’t know until she goes back in the water) this will have cured that nose in the air and lack of performance problem.
Your itama is a great med sea boat....... I did consider buying an old magnum 40 instead but I couldn’t find one with the right power, and didn’t want to have to buy new engines ! Even my madness has its limits !
In fairness I bought it in June and it was hopelessly unbalanced. Not only did it have a 100kg of passarelle mounted on the transom but it also had a 200kg 4kw genie mounted.......yup, right in the bathing platform and directly over the surface drives. I had to drive her with about 30% flaps just to get her to run flat.......and given the flaps are about 3 ft long, that is a lot of drag ! I think these boats were designed to handle the sea, She is basically one long thin V shape, but as you say if the weight is messed up then they just don’t go....... I will know more in the spring ! Fingers crossed.
Do I sound a bit defensive of my baby ?
She now has no passarelle, and the old generator has been replaced with a new Fischer panda 3.5 kw which weighs 80kg from memory. Hopefully (and I won’t know until she goes back in the water) this will have cured that nose in the air and lack of performance problem.
Your itama is a great med sea boat....... I did consider buying an old magnum 40 instead but I couldn’t find one with the right power, and didn’t want to have to buy new engines ! Even my madness has its limits !
MapisM
Well-Known Member
I don't think to have misunderstood dancrane's question. He even went on saying "I'd like the boating equivalent of a BMW M5 - hugely fast"...!
Don't get me wrong PF, you know that I'm also a fan of Itamas, Magnums, OTAMs, whatever.
But you'll forgive me if I struggle to put your 28kts fight with a Sunseeker under the "hugely fast" boating category, in my books.
That's a speed which some ferries connecting Corsica and Sardinia are capable of, FFS!
And surely in even worse conditions than your Itama...
Portofino
Well-Known Member
I don't think to have misunderstood dancrane's question. He even went on saying "I'd like the boating equivalent of a BMW M5 - hugely fast"...!
Don't get me wrong PF, you know that I'm also a fan of Itamas, Magnums, OTAMs, whatever.
But you'll forgive me if I struggle to put your 28kts fight with a Sunseeker under the "hugely fast" boating category, in my books.
That's a speed which some ferries connecting Corsica and Sardinia are capable of, FFS!
And surely in even worse conditions than your Itama...
It’s all relative to the sea state in the real world P -
I used that example of a real life situation to attempt demonstrate the effect of two things - which Boatbore got !
I was not inferring 28 knots is the magic figure It just turned out to be the figure on that day - which qualifies using the criteria I outlined in my definition,that you asked for .
On another day in different sea states that No will be different.
I ,am thinking PC in the sense of Performance Cruiser for offshore useage and extended time aboard here , not out and out speed machine that you reffferd to a “ lake boat “ - the one in your post of a previous boat .
The Two things I hope brought to the party ( folks keep posting pics of 87 mph boats or what ever on mirrow calm seas ) Well where are these boats I don,t see them about in the med ** ?
1- waves - note in posts ^^ I have been referring to “ headline grabbing “ printed top speeds and what I call Real World speeds -
2- I introduced weight distribution- took a gamble on this -either ridiculed as usual by all the VP outdrive mob and Merc btw , cos that’s how they come and they are brainwashed .After all there’s nowt that can be done regarding doing any other except plonk the heaviest iron at the transom .
How ever Boatbore above seems to have identified with exactly what I mean ,t -see posts #30 / 31 ^^^
For all know could have been him indeed .
The conditions where not lake like ,but not exceptional either if you have to or want to Cruise every day .No wimping out sitting out the weather .
Tell you what I will race you from Cannes to Calvi ( Corsica) 100 miles each way - 200 miles a day
Your lake 60; Knot er boat and my boat cruises mid 30 s
Oh just one thing like any sensible race let’s do a few laps - with your wife and guests too aboard - no point being selfish- let’s share the rides
10 consecutive days —- then add up the 10 aggregate times — oh and you can choose the start day - how’s that - Anybody in a 800 Hp 20 ftr can at least turn up and start on day 1 too
Only one V simple rule - you are disqualified if a passenger ( presume wife or close partner ) bails out
Not sure where a 300 ft ferry enters the Performance Crusier debate ?
The M5 is fast by everyday standards for most folks it’s very practical but limeted out of the box to only 155 mph .How ever its discrete which I understood was the point .Comparing to a Subaru WRX , an other 4 seater
It’s actually not that fast ,but in the real world on real roads it’s fast enough a big trip across Europe , it’s only Germany that possibly ( legally ) you will notice the 155 Mph with four adults and there luggage .
Only a Bentley Silver Spur 192 mph will slip past carry the same load , or a Masa QP,
Of course many mid engines two seaters will outperform the M5 .
Interesting if it snows —— ie crossing the Alps - car equivalent to a boat in a BIG sea ( that’s a liesure boat not a ferry
) I think the 2 WD , M5 and certainly the various mid engined two seaters ( ground clearance issues and lack of low profile snow tyre Fittment ) - will not just slow - but grind to a halt .
meanwhile the Bentley with 4 WD snow tyres and adjustable air suspension set high will carry on with 4 persons and luggage and arrive 1 st at the Spendido in Portofino after all setting setting off together from Berlin ,
Agree before anybody chimes in the M5 will be the fasted round the Nurburgring ring .
I,am thinking real world roads journeys and real world Performance cruiser s in a boat .
Hope that clarifys it .
Some ones gonna post a pic of a Santa pod gragster doing 300 mph in 10sec or somthing and telling me a Bentley is a slow car
** - sure I’ve seem a few “ Cigarette “ and Donzi 43s - petrols here and there in the Cote d Azur. But by heck they don,t 1/2 slam at speed , for the 1/2 hour they can last from St Trop to Pampalone .
Usually a miserable trip back when the winds blowing down the bay from Port Grimaud — Oh one more observation- young guys and boat full of totty .Girls putting a brave face on with the tangled wet expensive local hair do destroyed in the process .
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Boatbore
Well-Known Member
I think you are both making valid points....... of course Portofino is right about it’s not just about speed, but handling too. And in fairness to Mapis, I think the original thread was a speed focussed theme......
But the fun bit of this thread is that it’s hypothetical. The OP is a rag and stick man, but he likes the look of an old sexy powerboat.......so he wonders what are the limitations on making one go really fast ...... simples.
The answer of course, is that there isn’t one........... there are hundreds of answers, And the great benefit of this forum is that a lot of us powerboat anoraks love to share our varied (and hopefully very wise) views.
In truth, we all equally admire the pros of most boats, and also recognise the cons of those same boats, which is where choice comes in. Some people want to be the fastest, others want to be the most comfortable, And some want some balance of those two things ........ which is why there are hundreds if not thousands of different Boat manufacturers out there, all of whom think their boats are the best !
As to racing to Calvi and back 10 times...... I’m not sure there is a boat out there that I would want to do that in (the ferry does spring to mind) but maybe that’s a different question altogether. The rag and stick brigade might suggest they race your Itama ....... to Barbados and back....... they will win that one you know !!!
But the fun bit of this thread is that it’s hypothetical. The OP is a rag and stick man, but he likes the look of an old sexy powerboat.......so he wonders what are the limitations on making one go really fast ...... simples.
The answer of course, is that there isn’t one........... there are hundreds of answers, And the great benefit of this forum is that a lot of us powerboat anoraks love to share our varied (and hopefully very wise) views.
In truth, we all equally admire the pros of most boats, and also recognise the cons of those same boats, which is where choice comes in. Some people want to be the fastest, others want to be the most comfortable, And some want some balance of those two things ........ which is why there are hundreds if not thousands of different Boat manufacturers out there, all of whom think their boats are the best !
As to racing to Calvi and back 10 times...... I’m not sure there is a boat out there that I would want to do that in (the ferry does spring to mind) but maybe that’s a different question altogether. The rag and stick brigade might suggest they race your Itama ....... to Barbados and back....... they will win that one you know !!!
Greenheart
Well-Known Member
So much knowledge here. It's great to see how right and well-reasoned your descriptions all are, in your areas of focus.
It's also amusing how similar are the cases you make, for one design versus another, to the arguments made for and against different sailing yachts.
In my unlearned, wind-fuelled imagination, I was supposing that it might prove fun (and not prohibitive) to keep an old but pretty motor-boat, ideally a speedy petrol that is so ruddy thirsty, her asking price would be low compared with sensible, heavier diesel boats.
Sorry for being misleading - I wasn't necessarily thinking about boats as big as the Sunseeker I started with - she'd be prohibitive in any condition. And given the bouncy Solent chop I'm accustomed to, it occurs to me that most of the boats which are small enough to be cheap enough, aren't likely to give a very serene ride on most days. But I'm grateful for the lesson in the importance of deadrise angle - I won't forget that, if a tempting opportunity comes along.
I'd be chuffed to bits if YBW forumites started racing round the Med on the strength of a thread I'd started. :biggrin-new: :encouragement:
It's also amusing how similar are the cases you make, for one design versus another, to the arguments made for and against different sailing yachts.
In my unlearned, wind-fuelled imagination, I was supposing that it might prove fun (and not prohibitive) to keep an old but pretty motor-boat, ideally a speedy petrol that is so ruddy thirsty, her asking price would be low compared with sensible, heavier diesel boats.
Sorry for being misleading - I wasn't necessarily thinking about boats as big as the Sunseeker I started with - she'd be prohibitive in any condition. And given the bouncy Solent chop I'm accustomed to, it occurs to me that most of the boats which are small enough to be cheap enough, aren't likely to give a very serene ride on most days. But I'm grateful for the lesson in the importance of deadrise angle - I won't forget that, if a tempting opportunity comes along.
I'd be chuffed to bits if YBW forumites started racing round the Med on the strength of a thread I'd started. :biggrin-new: :encouragement:
Boatbore
Well-Known Member
Buy an old Fletcher Zingaro, Or an old Hunton gazelle 28 ft...... both will fit that bill, almost certainly have a single Petrol engine, and are surprisingly decent sea boats given their size.
Boatbore
Well-Known Member
Sunseeker Monterey 27, would also fit that bill.
All fast(ish) boats, decent sea keeping, with some sort of interior for occasional overnights. All old, all cheap, and all available originally with thirsty petrols
I’m sure there are others, like the sea ray pachanga mentioned much earlier as well
All fast(ish) boats, decent sea keeping, with some sort of interior for occasional overnights. All old, all cheap, and all available originally with thirsty petrols
I’m sure there are others, like the sea ray pachanga mentioned much earlier as well
MapisM
Well-Known Member
Very well said.
@ Portofino: thanks for your offer, but it doesn't take a seatrial to know that in sea conditions rough enough to barely allow an Itama 48 to cruise at mid 30s, any 25 footer (not just a Fountain!) is slower.
My whole point, regardless of sea conditions, is that mid 30s can NEVER be called "really fast" (let alone hugely fast!) by any stretch of imagination.
I'm well aware that your Itama can keep a pretty good cruising speed when many other P boat wouldn't.
But that's what it is - a good cruising speed, nothing else: you are talking of something any autopilot can deal with, and that has nothing to see with driving a really fast boat.
It's no coincidence that Itamas were designed for boaters who wanted to have lunch in San Felice Circeo, then jump onboard and go to Ponza or Palmarola for a swim with the babes suntanning on the aft cushions, returning in time to drive back to Rome for dinner.
Just 20Nm or so each way, but in open sea, which occasionally can get rather choppy. Itamas, Baias, and the likes are just perfect for that.
But Imho, they don't even deserve being mentioned when talking of really fast boats, because none of them can make it to the top 100 ranking - and no, it's not a typo: I really mean top 100, not top 10.
Sure, no boat on earth capable of 3 digits speeds can go that fast in an F6, but so what? That doesn't make mid 30s cruising "really fast", surely!
Besides, since you seem to think that driving a really fast boat on glass like conditions is easy and/or boring, have a look at the following video.
And mind, that's "just" a plain Schiada (20' or so, I'd guess) with a very powerful engine.
We aren't even touching yet the air entrapment hulls league, let alone turbine powered ones...
Portofino
Well-Known Member
Dancranes post #16
2nd para has the original Q
“I wonder if anybody is building really fast boats which could be cruised, and stressing the performance rather than the accommodation?”
I took that as a Q with two parts the “really fast and “ could be cruised “
I thought if best to respond to the whole Q not just one part in particular not loosing sight of the “ could be cruised “
Attempting to balance both ends of the question in one answer .
The “ could be cruised “ bit eliminates the type of boats you are suggesting.
The marques I suggested Itama , Baia ,Otam , Magnum , and happy to add Pershing - can all be had with Arnesons sub 15 M
Which I think we are talking in ?
Back to comfort the laws of physics know no boundaries.
I had a conversation with a guy that worked up through the Sunseeker range of Preditors , 55 on ArInes , 82 on Arnies . 108 on Arnies , then switched to a Pershing 108 ( berth constraints in Port Hercule )
His Captain told me the Pershing can run at 45 knots in bigger seas without slamming .No need to throttle back .
The Sunseeker ( was a triple btw ) although faster paper than the Pershing was a terrible slammer in like for like conditions for a 108 ftr - often bearly exceeding mid thirties , a huge headroom of Performance out of reach in all but calm / flat seas
After a couple of seasons of Sod’s law sea states the wife said the SS had to go .
The Pershing ( slower on paper ) has saved the marriage
Again the C *word pops up and trumps the F*word ——
Of course the triple Pred 108 is the FASTER boat if that was the Q
But tack the C * word on the Q then the Pershing is the better boat
C* Cruised
F* Fast / really Fast etc
As you say there are loads just “ really fast “ without the “ cruised “ bit of the Question of flat bottomed bin lids with mega Hp , some with copter engines , U tube is littered with ex.
2nd para has the original Q
“I wonder if anybody is building really fast boats which could be cruised, and stressing the performance rather than the accommodation?”
I took that as a Q with two parts the “really fast and “ could be cruised “
I thought if best to respond to the whole Q not just one part in particular not loosing sight of the “ could be cruised “
Attempting to balance both ends of the question in one answer .
The “ could be cruised “ bit eliminates the type of boats you are suggesting.
The marques I suggested Itama , Baia ,Otam , Magnum , and happy to add Pershing - can all be had with Arnesons sub 15 M
Which I think we are talking in ?
Back to comfort the laws of physics know no boundaries.
I had a conversation with a guy that worked up through the Sunseeker range of Preditors , 55 on ArInes , 82 on Arnies . 108 on Arnies , then switched to a Pershing 108 ( berth constraints in Port Hercule )
His Captain told me the Pershing can run at 45 knots in bigger seas without slamming .No need to throttle back .
The Sunseeker ( was a triple btw ) although faster paper than the Pershing was a terrible slammer in like for like conditions for a 108 ftr - often bearly exceeding mid thirties , a huge headroom of Performance out of reach in all but calm / flat seas
After a couple of seasons of Sod’s law sea states the wife said the SS had to go .
The Pershing ( slower on paper ) has saved the marriage
Again the C *word pops up and trumps the F*word ——
Of course the triple Pred 108 is the FASTER boat if that was the Q
But tack the C * word on the Q then the Pershing is the better boat
C* Cruised
F* Fast / really Fast etc
As you say there are loads just “ really fast “ without the “ cruised “ bit of the Question of flat bottomed bin lids with mega Hp , some with copter engines , U tube is littered with ex.
Portofino
Well-Known Member
Hey hang on I never said “ it’s easy or boring “ in relation to driving fast or really or hugely fast boats or any boats for that matter - when did I say that ?
Well after 3 mins in that - then what ? Again , ok 6 mins
Gold fish in a bowl springs to mind .
I wonder if that guy ^^^ is amenable to joining Hugo,s MBY kill cord trial :encouragement:
I think a pic paints a 1000 words
View attachment 68449
This ones got a cabin / berths and a bog too - so there’s a bit of C in there somewhere .
I,love take this one a 65 knot er - on in my Calvi Chalange .
Was thinking of adding a second rule to finishing with all passengers ——- Harrods donate a crystal glass set and fine bone China set — every piece broken add a penalty time —- hmmm perhaps not
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